M52 Water pump pulley bolts |
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Andrew Rolland
Moderator Group Go away rain Joined: 19-August-2004 Location: Scotland Status: Offline Points: 6579 |
Topic: M52 Water pump pulley bolts Posted: 06-January-2006 at 08:40 |
A query for you all to ponder over. I have just bought a new water pump (OEM) for my E39 from Euro Car Parts for the sum of £37.71 inc vat. Henry Bros want £70.50 for a BMW one. Looking at in the box, I have measured the spaces between the 4 bolt holes that secure the pulley onto the hub. The 4 holes are not located at the corners of a square but at the corners of a rectangle. Two of the bolts holes are the same distance from the centre of the pump spindle which id different from the other two. This means that the water pump pulley can only be bolted to the hub in two positions and not four. This seems a bit strange to me as I would have thought the bolt holes would all be at the same distance radially from the centre of the pump spindle but they are not on this new pump. I was under the impression that my car has the bolt holes at the same spacings. Can anyone confirm this before I go and strip out the old pump tomorrow morning? Andrew |
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sleeper
Really Senior Member II Original and STILL best Joined: 26-March-2004 Location: East Sussex/Kent border Status: Offline Points: 2098 |
Posted: 06-January-2006 at 08:46 |
no they are not equal about the centre. they are grouped holes, rotate thro' 90 degrees and it fits. |
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Andrew Rolland
Moderator Group Go away rain Joined: 19-August-2004 Location: Scotland Status: Offline Points: 6579 |
Posted: 06-January-2006 at 08:56 |
Thanks Sleeper. I phoned up ECP and they told me it was the correct pump for all 6 pot M52 BMW engines regardless of age. I am aware that there is a change of things in Sep 1998 which is just after my build date so I was worried I may have a slightly different pump but I don't so everything is tickety boo! Andrew |
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sleeper
Really Senior Member II Original and STILL best Joined: 26-March-2004 Location: East Sussex/Kent border Status: Offline Points: 2098 |
Posted: 06-January-2006 at 08:57 |
no sweat - I did one last weekend and went through the same thing!! Cheers! |
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Andrew Rolland
Moderator Group Go away rain Joined: 19-August-2004 Location: Scotland Status: Offline Points: 6579 |
Posted: 06-January-2006 at 09:08 |
Any other special tips as to how to get the viscous fan off i.e how to stop the hub from turning, apart from hit the spanner with a hammer to try and shock it off? Which is what you told me last time I asked. The reason I was checking about the bolt centres is that I was thinking of making a tool up from flat bar to hold the pulley still while heaving on the hub nut. Andrew |
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Current '13 62 F10 535i MSport Auto Previous '04 04 E60 545i SE Auto '03 53 E60 545i SE Auto (Stolen) '98 S E39 523i SE Auto |
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Andrew Rolland
Moderator Group Go away rain Joined: 19-August-2004 Location: Scotland Status: Offline Points: 6579 |
Posted: 06-January-2006 at 11:20 |
Just had a look at the car while out feeding the greedy parking meter that greed Glasgow City Council have installed out side my office and sure enough the water pump pulley hub bolts are located on a rectangular pattern. You learn summat new every day! Andrew |
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sleeper
Really Senior Member II Original and STILL best Joined: 26-March-2004 Location: East Sussex/Kent border Status: Offline Points: 2098 |
Posted: 06-January-2006 at 11:25 |
tips, err the one I've just done wouldn't knock off with t'hammer either so I locked the pulley with a big flat-blade screwdriver and tapped it off. ...and yes, I am an octopus! (it is possible) BTW - I use a ground-down sink spanner from B&Q - big cast alloy fella, and it works a treat! |
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Andrew Rolland
Moderator Group Go away rain Joined: 19-August-2004 Location: Scotland Status: Offline Points: 6579 |
Posted: 08-January-2006 at 11:52 |
Well I tried yesterday for nearly 2 hours trying to 'tap off' the viscous coupling. Gave up in the end so I didn't get my new thermostat, cover and water pump in place but I did manage to renew about half the coolant. I tried to lock the pulley with a screwdriver between the pulley bolts but I used a thin diameter one so it wouldn't foul the spanner on the hub and it bent then snapped in two! Sleeper, how exactly did you lock the pulley hub? My dad suggested looking for a different tool to take the nut off, I'll have a look for that sink spanner from B&Q. I presume you ground it down in terms of width? I'll have a hunt on the old t'interweb for specialist tools. Andrew |
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gtmoore
Advanced Newbie Joined: 08-June-2005 Location: Croydon, Surrey Status: Offline Points: 34 |
Posted: 08-January-2006 at 12:12 |
I'm sorry to hear you're having trouble with this. I've only ever
changed them using this method and I've done a few. It does need quite
a belt though and a heavy hammer is best.
It's a stupid question cos I think on earlier postings you've said you were aware of it being a reverse thread but you're definitely hitting it the right way? (clockwise when facing the engine) Perhaps it's just a tight one and you do need to make up a tool to stop the pump pulley turning - it's never a nice feeling using a hammer on a piece of precision engineering! I think I'll probably do that in future if the 'whack it hard' method isn't 100% successful as I thought it was before this |
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Gavin
Current: E39 525iSE Auto 2001 Previous: E34 530iV8 Auto 1994 E34 520iSE Auto 1994 E34 520iSE Manual 1990 |
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sleeper
Really Senior Member II Original and STILL best Joined: 26-March-2004 Location: East Sussex/Kent border Status: Offline Points: 2098 |
Posted: 08-January-2006 at 14:18 |
andrew, I have done 8 of these waterpumps and only had one difficult one - I guess you are unlucky! the sink spanner is gound down to about 4 mm thick, which allows me to get a big flathead screwdriver on the pulley bolts. Believe me, use the biggest hammer you have got! If its really tricky, get an assistant if you can, and one that has hand insurance! pity you are right up the other end of the UK - email me if you need more help.... |
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Andrew Rolland
Moderator Group Go away rain Joined: 19-August-2004 Location: Scotland Status: Offline Points: 6579 |
Posted: 08-January-2006 at 16:02 |
Thanks guys, I was hitting it in the correct direction, Left hand thread and all that, me and the old boy, striking the end of the viscous spanner with a 2lbs hammer and nowt. Stuck fast. Andrew |
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gilescooperuk
Groupie Joined: 29-December-2005 Location: Peterborough Status: Offline Points: 56 |
Posted: 08-January-2006 at 18:04 |
I don't have one of these cars but....
why not undo the pump bolts and remove the pump and the fan at the same time, then with the now scrap pump on the bench separate it by clamping the impeller in a vice so it can't twist. Just seems that if you are taking the pump off why fuss with trying to remove the fan in the engine bay. Giles |
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Andrew Rolland
Moderator Group Go away rain Joined: 19-August-2004 Location: Scotland Status: Offline Points: 6579 |
Posted: 08-January-2006 at 20:56 |
You can't get to the water pump to block bolts as these are hidden behind the water pump pulley. You can't remove the water pump pulley without first removing the viscous fan coupling I'm afraid. In other words Have a look at your 1989 525i E34 and you will see what I mean. It will be of similar construction I would think to my M52 lump on my E39. Andrew |
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Nick
Bavarian-Board Contributor BMWCC Area Organiser Yorks & Humber Joined: 21-October-2002 Location: God’s own county... Yorkshire Status: Offline Points: 1319 |
Posted: 09-January-2006 at 04:29 |
I agree these are nasty when they are tight.. you end up thinking am I whacking away with the lump hammer in the wrong direction.. so you reverse what you are doing and end up tightening the thing even more.
You can buy the correct tool that locks on to the bolts which is what I shall do if it ever needs doing again. Nick |
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sleeper
Really Senior Member II Original and STILL best Joined: 26-March-2004 Location: East Sussex/Kent border Status: Offline Points: 2098 |
Posted: 09-January-2006 at 04:44 |
try some 'plus-gas' disassembly spray, works on everything... |
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Chas C
Really Senior Member II Nothing new under the sun Joined: 15-December-2004 Location: Aberdeenshire Status: Offline Points: 1620 |
Posted: 09-January-2006 at 12:16 |
Makes you wonder if someone previously tried to remove it assuming it was a normal thread...
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sleeper
Really Senior Member II Original and STILL best Joined: 26-March-2004 Location: East Sussex/Kent border Status: Offline Points: 2098 |
Posted: 09-January-2006 at 12:18 |
easily done though chas, especially working from below.... |
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Andrew Rolland
Moderator Group Go away rain Joined: 19-August-2004 Location: Scotland Status: Offline Points: 6579 |
Posted: 11-January-2006 at 03:12 |
I have now bought this tool to use next Saturday morning. Is this what you were referring to Nick? I just need to wait and see when Mister Postman delivers it! If this one fails I think I might have to end up buying this tool which you can get from good old ECP even cheaper than on here. Andrew PS if the second one fails I think I mights have to end up buying another E39 at this rate! |
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Be exclusive and drive a Petrol 5 Series!
Current '13 62 F10 535i MSport Auto Previous '04 04 E60 545i SE Auto '03 53 E60 545i SE Auto (Stolen) '98 S E39 523i SE Auto |
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Andrew Rolland
Moderator Group Go away rain Joined: 19-August-2004 Location: Scotland Status: Offline Points: 6579 |
Posted: 11-January-2006 at 03:16 |
Doubt it. The previous owner was religious in getting everything done at BMW, even tyres. I have all the receipts for everything and they are all BMW and none of them are for work which would have required removal of the fan. I would like to assume that if BMW had a shot at removing it they would have done it correctly. Emm maybe not going by my experience of my Local Main $tealer! I think with nearly 8 years of 6 cylinder heat the nut has welded itself to the pulley spindle. It will of course not been greased when it was assembled by BMW. Had the nut been greased then I bet there would not be this problem. Any nut or bolt I remove from any car gets greased before it gets put back. Andrew Edited by Andrew Rolland |
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Be exclusive and drive a Petrol 5 Series!
Current '13 62 F10 535i MSport Auto Previous '04 04 E60 545i SE Auto '03 53 E60 545i SE Auto (Stolen) '98 S E39 523i SE Auto |
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Bill-
Really Senior Member I Joined: 06-July-2005 Location: 5 miles from Brands Hatch Status: Offline Points: 434 |
Posted: 11-January-2006 at 13:25 |
How about heating the nut up briefly with a butane blowtorch or similar, just to allow the nut to swell a little. If your careful, kind of wave the flame about quite a bit it should be ok (not setting fire to your beloved car I mean) |
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