Print Page | Close Window

525d Power Lag

Printed From: Bavarian-Board.co.uk - BMW Owners Discussion Forum
Category: Regional & Specific Forums
Forum Name: Irish Forum
Forum Discription: where Irish members can discuss upcoming events, etc.
URL: http://www.bavarian-board.co.uk/forum_posts.asp?TID=36826
Printed Date: 27-April-2024 at 09:24


Topic: 525d Power Lag
Posted By: uoi1772
Subject: 525d Power Lag
Date Posted: 16-April-2007 at 00:14
Anybody shed any light what could cause a power lag between 1-3x1000rpm? Thing is, the power really kicks in at 3x1000 rpm and the car flies. I've changed the Air Filter and the Mass Air Flow Meter which has helped slightly. The car only has 60k on it. Just doesn't seem right! Any suggestions?

-------------
Diesel Power



Replies:
Posted By: denishogan
Date Posted: 16-April-2007 at 07:43
Could be the EGR valve... they can go - usually leading to flat spots in the power delivery. Not 100% certain, but if it is the EGR valve, it should show up during a diagnostic check - your local mechanic should be able to plug it in for you (or if you are looking for a specialist, you could try Border Motor Works outside Strabane).

It could also be one of those little hoses going to/from the turbo - they can crack.


-------------

http://www.irishhillclimb.com - Irish Hillclimb and Sprint Championship


Posted By: bmwcare
Date Posted: 16-April-2007 at 09:47
Originally posted by uoi1772 uoi1772 wrote:

Anybody shed any light what could cause a power lag between 1-3x1000rpm? Thing is, the power really kicks in at 3x1000 rpm and the car flies. I've changed the Air Filter and the Mass Air Flow Meter which has helped slightly. The car only has 60k on it. Just doesn't seem right! Any suggestions?


What car is this? Also, Manual or Auto?




-------------
BMW & Mercedes Specialist.
Galway & Surrounding Areas.
http://www.bmwcare.com - www.bmwcare.com
http://www.mercedescare.com - www.mercedescare.com
All BMW models covered including E60/E90/F01/F10 with flash programming/CIP/coding as required


Posted By: Kin Mak
Date Posted: 16-April-2007 at 13:39
Turbo lag?

-------------
http://www.kinmak.com - KinMak.com - http://www.elara.ie - Elara Online


Posted By: flyingalexf68
Date Posted: 16-April-2007 at 20:15
Originally posted by Kin Mak Kin Mak wrote:

Turbo lag?


It's not an Impreza Kin. Turbos on diesels kick in around 1500rpm and are
at full boost (peak torque) at around 1800.

-------------
1995 e36 3.0 M3 Coupe, Daytona Violet, AP Racing BBK, CCFL Angel Eyes, M3 Spoiler, M-Tec 3 Steering Wheel.   
2000 530d Steptronic, Poverty Spec, 18" Alloys.


Posted By: uoi1772
Date Posted: 17-April-2007 at 23:15

Noticed a slight leak on the ground at home and in the usual place where I park in work, which makes me think, it could be cracked turbo hose you suggested, but I will have the diagnostics checked for that EGR valve you also pointed out that could be at fault.  

The cars an '02 525d with manual gearbox.

Will come back with any findings, cheers!



-------------
Diesel Power


Posted By: Kin Mak
Date Posted: 17-April-2007 at 23:30

Originally posted by flyingalexf68 flyingalexf68 wrote:

Originally posted by Kin Mak Kin Mak wrote:

Turbo lag?


It's not an Impreza Kin. Turbos on diesels kick in around 1500rpm and are
at full boost (peak torque) at around 1800.

Whatever mate, I don't drive tractors.

p.s. No offence... really.



-------------
http://www.kinmak.com - KinMak.com - http://www.elara.ie - Elara Online


Posted By: bmwcare
Date Posted: 18-April-2007 at 04:49
Originally posted by uoi1772 uoi1772 wrote:

Noticed a slight leak on the ground at home and in the usual place where I park in work, which makes me think, it could be cracked turbo hose you suggested, but I will have the diagnostics checked for that EGR valve you also pointed out that could be at fault.  

The cars an '02 525d with manual gearbox.

Will come back with any findings, cheers!



EGR is a possibility.
There is a full test procedure that can be carried out during a diagnostic session. Either a dealer with GT1 or Independent with Autologic will have this facility. Other aftermarket tools are generally crap at diagnosing this.

There is also a flash update for that DDE - get your tech to check the programming slots and see if it has been updated. That may cure your problem - but it won't mask a fault.

HTH,
Eddie.

PS: Kin, the best putdown I've found for diesels is (as quoted from a builder that had a few Rollers in his time - he was asked by an eejit was it diesel), "look, Diesel is for mixers..."




-------------
BMW & Mercedes Specialist.
Galway & Surrounding Areas.
http://www.bmwcare.com - www.bmwcare.com
http://www.mercedescare.com - www.mercedescare.com
All BMW models covered including E60/E90/F01/F10 with flash programming/CIP/coding as required


Posted By: T.J.
Date Posted: 18-April-2007 at 09:16

Interesting post.... I've a manual 525TDS and there's nothing below 2,300rpm when the turbo spools up suddenly and spits you down the road - for another 1,500 rpm anyway! 

The car is pretty limp below that, to a point where it requires 1,800rpm and clutch slip to take off on an incline with any haste & to ensure it doesn't stall.

Car is smooth out throughout rev range, produces great economy (46mpg on long journeys measured from tank) etc and nothing from the running suggests there's anything wrong - except for above obviously.

Chatting to previous owner, he said that when he had lower end work done, there was a temp flywheel in, and garage adjusted fueling down via software and it ran as described. New flywheel went in, garage reset most stuff but never adjusted fueling up and owner just left it as it was until I bought it 50k later.

How feasible is this to do?? I didn't think fueling was that adjustable... or that doing so could keep the car runing smooth, refined, no spikes or flat spots etc.. just relatively dead until the turbo kicks in.

And before any smart lag comments Kin, it ain't lag!



-------------
Mazda 6 MPS
S1 Elise 135 Sport
Alfa Romeo 159 Sportwagon
http://www.bmwcarclubireland.com/gallery/displayimage.php?pos=-3254">

Formerly E39 TDS, E36 M3, E36 328i, E34 525i, E34 518i


Posted By: denishogan
Date Posted: 18-April-2007 at 10:48
@uoi1772: a cheap dirty way of finding out if it is the EGR valve is to block off the exhaust side of it completely using a little metal plate - then take it for a drive - you should notice the difference. It's a bit of a hack job and don't recommend it.

@TJ: The turbo on my yoke starts to spool up round 2200-2300 - same as yours. But it has a decent amount of torque - it doesn't need to be revved to get away unless you are on a reasonably steep incline. Although it's not quite fit for any sort of a Hill at the moment.


-------------

http://www.irishhillclimb.com - Irish Hillclimb and Sprint Championship


Posted By: Ben O Brien
Date Posted: 18-April-2007 at 11:28

Mine was the same as ye describe lads, the chipping did a lot for it but before hand there was just nothing at any rev range (with all of my 115bhp!)

Still the economy isnt missed and im on the look out for another one again.

This 525d is it any relation to the older 525tds? OR is a 5 cyl version of the 530d? Ive never actually seen one up close or under the bonnet..

P.s. how are you getting on with it Denis?



-------------
99' 740iL   
99' 728i Sport
98' E39 M5 - Avus Blue, Dec Car!
96' M3 Saloon - Estoril Blue
94' M3 3.0 Convertible
91' E34 M5 - 3.6, Macau Blue

*E36 M3's Breaking*


Posted By: denishogan
Date Posted: 18-April-2007 at 12:00
It's a six pot Ben (afaik). I don't think BMW have ever done a five pot - but, as usual, I am open to correction on this. It's just a newer motor altogether.

My yoke is still sick - waiting for the parts to arrive. Should be able to get stuck into it early next week. Fingers crossed.


-------------

http://www.irishhillclimb.com - Irish Hillclimb and Sprint Championship


Posted By: T.J.
Date Posted: 18-April-2007 at 12:01
@ Denis - yeah mine seems to be lacking alot of torque below the turbo point. a 2.5 litre NA diesel should pull better.

-------------
Mazda 6 MPS
S1 Elise 135 Sport
Alfa Romeo 159 Sportwagon
http://www.bmwcarclubireland.com/gallery/displayimage.php?pos=-3254">

Formerly E39 TDS, E36 M3, E36 328i, E34 525i, E34 518i


Posted By: Ben O Brien
Date Posted: 18-April-2007 at 12:14

@ T.J, that is magnified even when it is chipped, i recall mine especially in 1st pulling away from a junction, if you let clutch out fully at say 1100rpm and floor it it would pause for a second, climb to 2200 slowly then whoosh... to around 4k ish..

@ Denis, hmmm 6 cyl, possibly a scaled down 530d so. Did you manage to do something about that timing chain..

Sure if you want a hand let me know ill be around,



-------------
99' 740iL   
99' 728i Sport
98' E39 M5 - Avus Blue, Dec Car!
96' M3 Saloon - Estoril Blue
94' M3 3.0 Convertible
91' E34 M5 - 3.6, Macau Blue

*E36 M3's Breaking*


Posted By: flyingalexf68
Date Posted: 18-April-2007 at 19:14
Something wrong there lads. It should be at full torque below 2300rpm. As I
said 1800-2000 is the norm for Turbo Diesels. The 530d will pull very
strongly from 1800rpm. You get pushed back into your seat. 2300 is far to
high for the power to come in. I'd normally be changing up a gear in my
Doblo van (1.9 JTD) at 2300-2500. And also now that I think, Pamela's
mums Range Rover has the 2.5 BMW engine from the 525tds. It has all its
power lower then 2300 as well. (not that it really has any power as it weighs
2.7 tonne empty)

-------------
1995 e36 3.0 M3 Coupe, Daytona Violet, AP Racing BBK, CCFL Angel Eyes, M3 Spoiler, M-Tec 3 Steering Wheel.   
2000 530d Steptronic, Poverty Spec, 18" Alloys.


Posted By: Ben O Brien
Date Posted: 18-April-2007 at 20:05

 

Well it does feel torquey below the power band, i.e you can start in 2nd and all that but the peak power or at least the start of the peak curve comes on just above 2k rpm and then you feel the boost.

The 530d would be a much more sophisticated animal!

Originally posted by flyingalexf68 flyingalexf68 wrote:

Pamela's
mums Range Rover has the 2.5 BMW engine from the 525tds. It has all its
power lower then 2300 as well. (not that it really has any power as it weighs
2.7 tonne empty)

I think you mean all the noise alex!



-------------
99' 740iL   
99' 728i Sport
98' E39 M5 - Avus Blue, Dec Car!
96' M3 Saloon - Estoril Blue
94' M3 3.0 Convertible
91' E34 M5 - 3.6, Macau Blue

*E36 M3's Breaking*


Posted By: flyingalexf68
Date Posted: 18-April-2007 at 21:29
Actually thats exactly what I mean. Not to mention the vibrations. Nice pic
Ben. Looks like someone having a laugh. They've taped up the lights to
make it more aerodynamic.

-------------
1995 e36 3.0 M3 Coupe, Daytona Violet, AP Racing BBK, CCFL Angel Eyes, M3 Spoiler, M-Tec 3 Steering Wheel.   
2000 530d Steptronic, Poverty Spec, 18" Alloys.


Posted By: uoi1772
Date Posted: 18-April-2007 at 22:49

The 530d aint more sophisticated than a 525d but it should definitely have more grunt than mine. These 2 motors have the same engine model code. Only difference is obviously capacity and the resultant output in power and torque 163bhp for mine and 184bhp for the 530d, these are '02 figures of course. The latest models are well up again on this.

There's a definite problem alright with the pick-up in mine between 1 and 3 rpm, for since i've had the car, it hasn't lagged like this before.

Someone mentioned earlier, a 530d pinning you to your seat when accelarating, this thing used to do the same before this lagging problem. 

Interesting though, when I booked the car in with local BMW dealer today, (who has a GT1 diagnostics tester) and explained the problem, they asked if I had the replacement Mass Air-Flow Meter programmed in when fitted. Not realising this needed to be done, they pointed out that they would do this first before running the diagnostics test.

Incidentally, BMW diesel badging was first td, then tds and now 'd'. The latest 2.5'd' has an output of 177bhp and the 3.0d 231bhp.

In hindsight TJ, my previous 2.5TDS never gave any trouble after 208k when I changed for this one, a real bulletproof motor!   



-------------
Diesel Power


Posted By: T.J.
Date Posted: 19-April-2007 at 08:52
That's what I'm hoping uoi1772 - I bought mine with 178k up on it, and a colleague had it for the previous 3yrs and 100k. It did throw a conrod @ 131k which required a bottom end rebuild though .... still on original turbo, intercooler etc etc.. 

-------------
Mazda 6 MPS
S1 Elise 135 Sport
Alfa Romeo 159 Sportwagon
http://www.bmwcarclubireland.com/gallery/displayimage.php?pos=-3254">

Formerly E39 TDS, E36 M3, E36 328i, E34 525i, E34 518i


Posted By: mick o c
Date Posted: 19-April-2007 at 20:09
Originally posted by uoi1772 uoi1772 wrote:

The 530d aint more sophisticated than a 525d but it should definitely have more grunt than mine. These 2 motors have the same engine model code. Only difference is obviously capacity and the resultant output in power and torque 163bhp for mine and 184bhp for the 530d, these are '02 figures of course. The latest models are well up again on this.

  

mine is 01 and its 194 bhp

-------------
mick
2001 530d steptronic


Posted By: uoi1772
Date Posted: 19-April-2007 at 22:28
Yes Mick you're right. In E39 guise, the 5 series diesels were initially 525TDS and 530d, 143bhp and 184bhp respectively. When the 525d came out in '01 it had 163bhp and the 530d was 194bhp!

-------------
Diesel Power


Posted By: jrafferty
Date Posted: 19-April-2007 at 23:14
I have just bought a 1997 525tds tonite and i find it has nothing until about 2000rpm and then it takes off..Oh and it has 220,000mls and drives as good as 60,000(thats bmw for ya)

-------------
bmw 323i tc baur(1985)bmw635csi man/lsd(1980)


Posted By: Ben O Brien
Date Posted: 20-April-2007 at 00:08

Originally posted by flyingalexf68 flyingalexf68 wrote:

Nice pic
Ben. Looks like someone having a laugh. They've taped up the lights to
make it more aerodynamic.

Ah Fe*k off! Thats a group A 350 bhp 242 being raced in oz in the early eighties... Wait til my T5 powered one is built ill take you for a scare in it!



-------------
99' 740iL   
99' 728i Sport
98' E39 M5 - Avus Blue, Dec Car!
96' M3 Saloon - Estoril Blue
94' M3 3.0 Convertible
91' E34 M5 - 3.6, Macau Blue

*E36 M3's Breaking*


Posted By: T.J.
Date Posted: 20-April-2007 at 09:19

@ jrafferty: 220k - nice!  I love seeing cars with big miles.

Mine drives like a 60k car too - a testament to the previous owner. Cheers Oisin!



-------------
Mazda 6 MPS
S1 Elise 135 Sport
Alfa Romeo 159 Sportwagon
http://www.bmwcarclubireland.com/gallery/displayimage.php?pos=-3254">

Formerly E39 TDS, E36 M3, E36 328i, E34 525i, E34 518i


Posted By: denishogan
Date Posted: 20-April-2007 at 09:27
@TJ: Didn't realize you bought Oisin's 5 - nice bus. Well wear!

-------------

http://www.irishhillclimb.com - Irish Hillclimb and Sprint Championship


Posted By: T.J.
Date Posted: 20-April-2007 at 10:40
I did indeed! And just fitted a nice set of 17s onto it too that I bought off of Gazzaa. So tis trucking along well now, i must say.

-------------
Mazda 6 MPS
S1 Elise 135 Sport
Alfa Romeo 159 Sportwagon
http://www.bmwcarclubireland.com/gallery/displayimage.php?pos=-3254">

Formerly E39 TDS, E36 M3, E36 328i, E34 525i, E34 518i


Posted By: jrafferty
Date Posted: 20-April-2007 at 20:11
wheels and cd boot loader are first on the list for mine aswell..its a bit of a basic model mine but we`ll get there

-------------
bmw 323i tc baur(1985)bmw635csi man/lsd(1980)


Posted By: uoi1772
Date Posted: 24-April-2007 at 13:27

Right, got car back from dealer today and got talking to technician. Denishogan and BMWCare you were very close, apparently it was a vacuum hose which had spilt and worked itself loose from the EGR valve, also there is a rod leading to the turbo which had seized.

So a new hose was fitted and the rod unseized. I also got a print-out from the GT1. There were unrelated faults which were dealt with and cleared. So the cars power is back to normal with the ability to pull tree stumps out of the ground!!! A good recommendation there boys! Thanks.



-------------
Diesel Power


Posted By: denishogan
Date Posted: 24-April-2007 at 13:41
Congratulations! Enjoy the power!



-------------

http://www.irishhillclimb.com - Irish Hillclimb and Sprint Championship


Posted By: T.J.
Date Posted: 24-April-2007 at 14:34
mighty stuff!

-------------
Mazda 6 MPS
S1 Elise 135 Sport
Alfa Romeo 159 Sportwagon
http://www.bmwcarclubireland.com/gallery/displayimage.php?pos=-3254">

Formerly E39 TDS, E36 M3, E36 328i, E34 525i, E34 518i


Posted By: Oisin
Date Posted: 24-April-2007 at 16:35

First off..its the fuel pump that needs a tuning I think!!it would give it that kick ye are looking for....

As before christmas on the old fuel pump in the engin bay,this was turned up to the last..great kick,but I still had difficulty starting and when cold it was a night mare stuttering down the road.the new pump was put in and the fueling also turned down and the kick was not the same..baverian Motors didnt want to turn up the new pump so early in its life,said it would do damage.



-------------
2006 VW Passat 1.9tdi
1995 E34 520i(M5)Sold.New classic required
Previous: 2004 Santa fee commercial - 2001 Saab 9-5 3.0,Tid - 1997 E39 525tds
                                                             


Posted By: Oisin
Date Posted: 24-April-2007 at 16:38

OH and..happy motoring TJ....those wheels look well...savage...........I miss my bemmer even more...bigcry

 

220miles on a 525tds.....love to hear that...love to know what been done to her



-------------
2006 VW Passat 1.9tdi
1995 E34 520i(M5)Sold.New classic required
Previous: 2004 Santa fee commercial - 2001 Saab 9-5 3.0,Tid - 1997 E39 525tds
                                                             



Print Page | Close Window