I can't fault your guts.

Are you doing the whole job with aerosols? You must have your very own ozone layer depletion right over your lock-up.

ultegra wrote: I can't fault your guts. Are you doing the whole job with aerosols? You must have your very own ozone layer depletion right over your lock-up.

lol, probably. i could, and i can get an excellent finish, but its a matter of getting material on the car, so its hopefully being sprayed (cellulose) with proper air gun etc this weekend. Running out of time, and i have already missed 3 summers, so i havnt got time to learn to properly spray.

when i started i didnt know how to weld, spray, or anything like this, so its been a great learning curve. guts? mmm, i can think of other words, but guts probably sounds better!

Craig,

I admire your bravery in taking on such a project!

What are you doing regarding the suspension? are you keeping the 4 stud hubs or converting to M3 ones? I only ask because your rear track looks a little narrow for the arches. M3 rear subframe is wider (I think!)

Jim.

Hi, that is a point. basically the side in that pic doesn't have the spacer, however, this pic should show better.

Its a massive amount of spacing, but i hope to remedy that when the car gets back on the road, with some bigger offset bbs's. at the moment these are just 7.5 j bk299's, and just aren't ideal. they look good enough for now. I'm not using normal spacers, these bolt to the hub, and then the wheel to that.

The whole chassis has been overhauled as well

The whole suspension has gone poly bushed, and adjustable where possible. I made my own coilover for the front, as the wheel's didnt look right in the m3 arches and i needed to fine tune the ride height.

Fushion Julz wrote: Looks like a pretty huge task, in all.... It certainly isn't an E30 M3, though, cos it has 2 too many cylinders, for a start....

and an extra litre lol! i expect it will be a totally different drive to an m3, although the chassis modifications should help keep the heavy lump pointing in the right direction! (i hope)

UweM3 wrote: I can understand you like the look of the M3 (so do I!!) but I can never understand why people want to have a M3 Convertible??? Have you ever seen a Sierra Cosworth without a roof? One would think with all the effort, time and money spend you should have sold the 325 and bought a proper M3 in the first place. At least some of your money would not be down the drain. Doing a conversion as this will always be a loss. Unless you find somebody keen for this car. But still admire you dedication to takle something like this. Good job. BTW trailing arms are all the same on any E30. The hubs are different.

purchasing a good convertible m3 would be around 9k, i bought the m3 kit for 450, and was quoted 1300 just to fit the rear arches. fitting in total has probably cost me under 1k, including the welding equipment. I also wanted to totally overhaul the suspension, so even m3 suspension was not what i had in mind (people upgrade m3 suspension alot),

and power i wanted around 300, so tweaking a genuine m3 engine is apparently very very expensive.

I must admit that i didnt intend to go this far, it all started off as just a simple 3.5 drop in, but went wrong somewhere along the lines.

As for it being a convertible, i always wanted one, but the 2.5 wasnt quick enough, i have seen a convertible cossy and to me it doesnt make sense, so i am sort of contradicsting myself here, but cosworth never made a convertible, bmw did.

Wth regard to it being a loss, then yes it is, if i put it on ebay as just another m3 conversion, but luckily i don't tire of the car, and owned it for two years prior to the three (plus) year conversion i am doing now, and an m10 318 prior to this.

i never set out to have the m3 kit, but i needed to fit bigger brakes in (with around 340 bhp i didnt like the idea of uprated standard brakes), that meant bigger wheels (and offset), and i really didnt want fibreglass. This sort of left me with m3 kit.

I think your points are valid, and it really is down to opinion and preference.

ive taken the 735i 1989 engine (218bhp) m30, added hartge throttle bodies 288 degree cam etc. this takes her to around 260>286, then running t70 very low pressure (on initial engine), at only 3psi. When i uprate the bottom end i'll run higher pressure, but for now its just to get all the kit on the engine running. And to not get on/off boost issues.

6psi should see me around 400, but from 170> 340 is a pretty good improvement. Im more into the handling and braking now, but i can at least take the engine further if i need to.

Hi, with the whole project, its been "yes i'll do that", and then ive had the chance of something better so have gone for that. the throttle bodies were supposed to give me much better power and keep the engine n/a, but now i will just be able to run much lower boost and keep the same power. reducing the lag effect of the turbo.

heres some pics of the suspension for you.

[/QUOTE]


And please don't fit the Cecotto front spoiler (please )

would you mind posting some pictures of you front strut conversion??[/QUOTE]

And yes, sourcing a genuine cecotto was sooooo difficult. Ive got the evo3 carbon fibre lip going on as well.

Being a convertilbe the m3 rear spoiler would look too "max power" for me, so im sticking to the sport double type.

Check it out! wrote:

And yes, sourcing a genuine cecotto was sooooo difficult. Ive got the evo3 carbon fibre lip going on as well.

Being a convertilbe the m3 rear spoiler would look too "max power" for me, so im sticking to the sport double type.

the struts i adapted from standard type, cutting the base off, and welding on a new spring platform, the spring were from my friends project (he is doing a baur m3 convertible even crazier, with the (4.0 v8 auto!), these springs were from him, so i will see how they go.

The brake kit is 360X32mm monster kit from Hi-spec Motorsport, shocks are spax psx, slightly uprated at the front, anti-roll bars are from bmw 2002.com (huge things, the car will never lean at all),

The rear will have alot of extra weight added (rear wings, foam filled etc) so im not too worried as yet about higher speed cornering.

evo 5? i thought e30 m3 went to evo 3, i.e. m3 front bumper+cecotto+carbon lip?

Rear has a twin sport spoiler, which will help although probably more through its weight than anything else, besides, tail end action is always better than front.

front camber is totally adjustable with coilover top mounts, bearings, spax psx have adjustable rates. I have two track days to tune it up on but the road is where i am more conerned at the mo. probably get some 265/30/18 rubber on the rear when i put 9j's on the back as opposed to current 7.5 j's.

and obviously f1 gsd3's all round as per current.

You are either very clever or you have too much time and money to burn!

I cant believe you are building nearly from scratch a hybrid m3 convertible type thingy with a whopping great big engine and a mixture of every single evolution m3 part ever made.

I am waiting for jeremy beadle to jump out in a minute

Good luck on your project

lol, thanks, i get this alot. Its taken over three years, and will probably total around 4. The problem ive had is that i have gone essentially for the best parts i can get for a road/ race setup (without full professional grade parts).

Cost hasn't been as bad as people might tink, as i have done to date all of the work myself (steep learning curve, knew very little at the start).

for example i was quoted 1300 just to fit and primer my rear wings, i took a week off work, and did this myself (god knows how it turned out so well).

The car will basically be brand new when i finish, with no part untouched. Ive re-built the speedo as well, clocked it to 0 as the car will then be "miles since re-build".

I have seen many e30's with similar ideas or concepts, but none the same so far. so its nice to do something different. saying that cost wise i could have bought a zm3!

It just seems more like a dream it will on the road some day, and with my mates and family its almost like a myth that the car exists its been hidden for so long!

oh, it used to look like this before the engine went. Should give you an idea its not oing to be tacky when finished!

UWE, i didnt shortent the struts, there was no need, and this would have just complicated things. in the pics you will see a professionally done set, but they didnt have the holes for abs sensors, so if anyones interested!!!!

good info on the evo3, thought it was just part added after part i.e. your "evo 5" lol.

rear springs im using the 35mm lower psx spax type that came with the kit.  The car isnt an all out race machine, its gotta be a daily/ weekend driver as well, so compromises have been made, but very few.

Judge,

I pretty much totally agree with what your saying, just before the project i had a similar opinion, but money wise bolting in the 3.5 was the cheapest power upgrade i could come across (it was already in an e30 prior to me getting it). in the end this proved no extra help, as the engine mounts were not up to spec, and i wanted the engine further back anyway.

i can remember my main concern being engine mounts back then, as my 2.5 lump was very quick, even compared to the 325 sport, and i was forever replacing engine mounts.

I have helped or rather "given my opinion" on a few subjects on here, particularly with regard to what wheels you can fit on the e30, and doing a manual gearbox conversion for the 2.5 (my auto box went that the car came with, and i decided to go manual).

I now know alot about the mechanics of the cars, and generally everyone i know asks me about upgrades etc just as friends.

Its highly likley i'll be adding a supercharger to my fathers z3 2.8, or he may just go zm3 not sure yet. even so. I had a look at the chassis and were going to try some shock and spring combinations from my e30, as my parts were practically new when they came off, and changing a set of rear springs is only a couple of hours job.

and then there's my little brothers mini etc etc the list goes on, and the sense of achievement you get from doing this is so good.

Your point on max power, i can remember about 6 years ago i used to buy that mag, then overnight it was full of fibreglass civic's that look like bm's and fiesta vans with 20k spent but still an oil leaking 1.0 engine. I hate tack, and have an exceptionally biased opinion. still, seeing these cars in real life provides me with a great chuckle, and they may not appreciate what i'm doing.

One thing i have come to learn is that so many "aftermarket" parts are either exceptionally poor quality (m3 mirrors anyone) or drastically overpriced.

its a minefiled, and getting the right balance of this on one car is very difficult. its also rarly as easy as "bolt on".

UweM3 wrote: Evo2 and Evo3 do NOT share any spoilers. Evo2 had the front attachment like yours and a additional little boot lip under the M3 wing. Evo3 was fitted with the flat front splitter directly to the standard M3 bumper with a little straigt extension and a wing extension. Evo5 is my own description when people just slap everything evo available on the car at the same time I repeat my questions about the struts, have you shortened them? I have converted M3 struts and was unable to get the front DOWN. What Front top mounts are you going to use? Nice ARB's BTW. Any idea what spring rates the rear springs have?

The top mounts are adjustable up to about 2.5 degrees extra negative camber, and because im using coilover i can tilt the strut closer as the spring doesn't touch the strut housing. You say you were not able to get the front down? were they height adjustable? i can adjust these down so that the tyre is within 8mm of the bottom of the arch, and this is without the engine in. It all depends on where you weld your base platform really. unless you encountered the top of the strut hitting the top mount!? or the damper was bottoming out?

thats a nice conversion. I don't have an issue with the tyre coming into contact with the strut, as the calipers need 60mm spare to the inside of the wheel (hence the whole m3 kit anyway).

I got my platform height by jacking the car to the right height checking travel etc, and then making the bottom 20% of the thread below the platform height. difficult to explain, but it gives me 80% of the thread above minimum ride height allowing for a heavy engine etc.

no problem with meeting up, but she's gonna be quite a few months yet, as soon as it is ill be attending every meet and event possible making up for the lack of previously!

on your setup the top cup comes down to the spring as well, whereas my cup takes the spring into it, so again i think that puts the front lower down. and the top mount as you say, lowers the suspension even further. this is why my weld height is totally different compared to the other coilover strut i have.

I hear you can get the struts bent to add another 1.5 degrees negative camber but then you are starting to affect wear and braking.

UweM3 wrote: I guess your top mounts are solid? This will give you 50mm less height to start with. I wanted to keep the rubber mounts and couldn't get the car back to the ride height it was sitting on the non height adjustable springs. You can't just weld the bottom platform lower and lower, there is a limit to it. A) the platform will not clear the tyre (unless silly ET's are used) B) you will run out of shock travel. I agree that things will get complicated when you shorten the strut (--> what inserts???) Maybe we meet up somewhere in the future and I can have a closer look to your conversion. (Gaydon??) here a pic:

just had a thought, this may be the one time not having an m3 benefits. i bet the m3 hub has a larger offset built into it, effectivley making the strut closer to the wheel for the same track width of the car. i.e. 325 narow track, but mine has been spaced out to m3. thus leaving the actual strut in the original "narrow" 325 configuration, and putting the wheel further away.

Ok, so i take it the control arms are the same though, as you always hear of people looking for the aluminium type if possible.

Yes, the bars on the front i have shown in the picture have about a 6mm wall thickness. They are ridiculously stiff, i cannot make them twist or deform in any way.

HI ron,

well, its looking firm for a respray this weekend,

Leathers are taking ages, but should be done by then and fitting them is no issue.

I basically expect the car to be nearing "visual" completion by then, but i doubt the engine will be in. I get home latish on most evenings, and only have the weekends to work on it of which sunday is useless after 2 due to family arrangements etc.

Im getting there as fast as possilble, and will be very very dissaponted if i miss much of this summer.

Are you hinting at showing the car, not sure if it would be worth trailering it there with no engine?

The car isn't going to be a show car, as in its finish, its finished to a very good standard, but as you probably know the finishing was done by me (unqualified!), so close examination will reveal this.

Let me know if you have anything in mind.

floody, just wondering, what and where can i get the spotlights? i don't have these, one of the few things im missing and having trouble sourcing.

Impressive job Craig , lots of interesting points raised .

Look forward to seeing the finished car !

cheers

Andy

Hopefully have it primered tonight ready for the weekend spray. Not sure if the bumpers will get in on that but i'll try. Think i may be out of plastic primer!

Some of the lad's may have a set going, as a lot take them out to put air intakes in for the front brakes.

If not you will need the light's, frame's and bracket's, the wireing should be insitue so I recon if you want to do it you will be looking at £70 to £90 all done.

You can still get all the part's, if you want the part nos. give me a shout

GSF and ECP sell the lights, much cheaper than the dealers, but they only come as the basic light unit, you will need the frame, and the bracket (which is M3 unique) which are all available from the dealers.
The rest is the same as any other pre-facelift E30.

Like I said, the lights are the same as pre-facelfit E30, just look under any E30 made before 1987, and they are the lights you need.

The rest is available from the dealers, I know because I bought some about 6 months ago, and came to my senses and decided to stick with the brake ducts.

Missed that point! thought they looked the same size. almost didnt seem worth shipping my mk1 mtec kit with the lights in now! good to know though, was expecting the whole "ah, m3 is it? ok, thats another 30% then please, identical part? oh yes sir"?

Part No's.

Lights off side 63171381419 near side 63171381420

frames 63171375051 x2  bracket's 51111940377 x2

screw's 63171367315 x4 in total should not be more than £60/70 from the dealer, all part's still listed

thanks Floody. I'll see if i can order them up end of month.

Hit a major setback on saturday. I was just final finishing the doors (after removing the side rubstrip that the m3 doesnt have), and found that some filler i had used previously that was old hadn't set properly.

I ended up using a new flat chisel to take it back to good filler which has put me out a full days work.  I could basically put grooves in it with my nail. Very disappointed. Getting the final finish is taking so long, but after this much effort cutting corners is going to ruin the whole project.

Still, very annoyed, and more work to do.

kbannon wrote: lushluke wrote: why dont you just buy one? i just spent 35k on one Maybe you should go on the internet and tell everyone! They might even think you are a really cool guy!

You think ?

Nigel wrote: kbannon wrote: lushluke wrote: why dont you just buy one? i just spent 35k on one Maybe you should go on the internet and tell everyone! They might even think you are a really cool guy! You think ?

Nah im thinking something else!!

lol, well we all have our real reasons for having a nice car, but i expect if you sepnt 35k, you bought a new one. whilst its a lovely car, i see too many of them around, with not enough people knowing how to drive them. Not saying this is the rule, but the original m3 is a drivers car, not all about the big numbers you can associate with the newer models.

Besides, rebuilding my car is alot cheaper than buying one. figure this, the only m3 part of the car is the bodywork. cost here has amounted to only £800 including all materials, and alot of work time.

Now you go and buy an m3, to the same standard mine will be finished, 9k. then i still have to do the engine, brakes, suspension, interior, wiring, the list goes on.

Oh, and another thing, when its done, i can look at it, say i did it, and there won't be one like it in the world. (its not even the same width as a normal m3). Its not for bragging rights for me, its about having a car exactly as i like it.

Unfortunetly i just can't be satisfied with a standard model, of which there are distinct advantages and disadvantages.

Overall if you enjoy the car, its great, but its nice to share it with someone else on a normal level.

hope you enjoy your car.

lushluke wrote: i dont think im cool an dont hate cus ive got a lush car

Says it all dont it..."come on luke to the lush mobile"  got any piccys of this £ 35 ooops sorry 35k motor

Luke, despite the skepticism do you intend to join any track days at all? Im sure i will get the chance, but my car originally is much much slower than an m3, and i wanted to get an idea on speed at some point of the finished car. You can't all out race on a track day, but a comparison with a willing accomplice should be possible. It would just be nice to see how everything that has been put into my car compares up to the latest and greatest?

Manners would be good, it was starting to feel like i was 18 again, fighting over a civic lol. the things we do hey!.

thanks for the comment fozzy. doors still got me riled though! all that work and i used some dodgy filler lol, its almost done now though, so hope to be back on track this weekend!

yes, thats the plan. im not fitting the m3 spoiler (would look overstated on the convertible i think), im using the mtec twin, as per previous.

car is about 1" wider at the rear than a normal m3 (wings welded on outside), and the wheels (18") fit the arches nicely. i don't want it scraping the floor as it won't handle any better that way.

leather is being re-trimmed in a creamy toffee/ black two tone, and tv's are only in the sunvisors so don't stand out too much.

reverse camera is going to be in the exhaust so again, concealed.

it won't be badged "335itc", and almost certainly not M3. I like the plain look.

no de-badging as again i don't think this looks right too "euro".

no airbrushing, no chrome wheels.

ive got it all set out, as i did 3 years ago. the main thing that has changed is the internals such as the engine, suspension and interior design.

The only questionable item is the crystal rear lights (not lexus tack!!!!), they are the red, and silver two tone type. i thin its a love or hate it job. ive put the l.e.d. bulbs in as well. i have a pick where i placed them in somewhere,and they look pretty good, but im stillnot 100% sure.

oh, and no aluminium mesh thats rusts within 2 mins!

i thought that, as per the original m3, but it just looks so american.

add to that my rear lights in two tone (they look wider than normal due to colours), and the fact its wider than a normal m3, and it looks like a transam with no spoiler. still, i can always change it back if need be.

it does and doesnt. i think the e30 looks very american with no spoiler, and looses some of its distinctive character.

ill see if i can get a pick of the rear lights in, with no spoiler at somepoint, i think you will see what i mean.