9 mpg, nearly as bad as my car in traffic

Would it be worthwhile offering to buy the pads if they throw in the car for free?

9MPG but only an average lowly speed of 22.4??

I was gonna put it down to driving an M-powered car as it should be, but now I'm not so sure

It has to be down to it being left running before being turned off - doesn't it.

I saw them driving the cars in the morning on the way to work and they were giving the cars hell on the runway so fuel consumption was not the most important thing on the cards, not the same as givin it hell on the open road at night  3 digit fun and stopping fast when some moran gets in the way

(Always drive within you capabilities )

Topazman

topazman wrote: I saw them driving the cars in the morning on the way to work and they were giving the cars hell on the runway so fuel consumption was not the most important thing on the cards, not the same as givin it hell on the open road at night  3 digit fun and stopping fast when some moran gets in the way (Always drive within you capabilities ) Topazman

That's disgraceful carry on young man, YOU of all people should know better

What at 148kph on the motorway  or was it mph???

Topazman

Ah mike you are alive long time no hear how are your latest mods going how about some feed back

Topazman

What about the sticker on the inside windscreen of the M5 that says "No full throttle for the first 2,000km"

I don't think I'd be happy buying one of these "demonstrators"

One of the fellas putting miles up on one of the "demonstrators" had no problem giving it full throttle off the lights when we had a little run against each other on the Stillorgan Road last week!! 

GusK wrote: One of the fellas putting miles up on one of the "demonstrators" had no problem giving it full throttle off the lights when we had a little run against each other on the Stillorgan Road last week!!

More importantly Gus - who won??

There's not many cars out there that can do a convicing job on the M3, but the new M5 is definetly one.

By the time we reached 80mph, he was about 4 car lengths ahead of me, and I wasn't holding back!!

kbannon wrote: JohnH wrote: What about the sticker on the inside windscreen of the M5 that says "No full throttle for the first 2,000km" I don't think I'd be happy buying one of these "demonstrators" Apparently one needs a new gearbox!

That sounds promising

kbannon wrote: yeah! I was talking to Dan in M&G today and he was telling me. He said that another's tyres all de-laminated. When I was there there was a blue one in the service shop!

See the infromation you can find at these things. I wonder will we hear more about gearbox problems etc. What are the chances of a recall on the new model, theres alot of electro gadgetry to go bonkers in these new machines.

I was reaing an article in a mag a while back, CBG magazine i think, and it was listing the most reliable cars, highest costs etc, etc. and i was amazed cars like the 7-series had a host of recalls across europe and Merc's did'nt look to clever either.

Having seen a few new 3's about i'm convinced it the worst designed beemer by a good mile or ten.

I see from the photo's the tyres are Conti sport contacts, what happened to sticky Michelin's?

Robbie Bradford wrote: I see from the photo's the tyres are Conti sport contacts, what happened to sticky Michelin's?

Maybe they had already burned those?

How much is a service gonna cost on these beasts, would'nt fancy being handed the invoice

I think the headsup display is a great addition to road cars and it's great to see BMW be the first to use it. This will be standard on most top marque's within the next 5-10 i'd imagine and susequently all models in the future.

Whatever about the design of the new wave, its great to see engineering and innovation is still alive and well, afterall this is what these cars are all about IMO.

Brother in laws 645ci conv has nearly all the option boxes ticked with plenty of electronic bits among them and was back for 2 software related recalls in the first 6 months and there are still some functions not working properly (little things like dashboard back lights, etc.!).

Loves the car but these things are irritating the crud out of him.

A bigger part of the problem is not so much the reliability of the systems (most recent BMW's have some sort of costly foibles (or at least for their time), SI boards on e30, e34, etc, pixel death on the e39 dashboards, vanos units on e36 M3 evo's, etc.) but rather the fact that the service personnel are still only getting to grips with the diagnosis, maintenance and repair protocols whicj means faffing around in trying to figure out whats gone wrong.

Sorry Robbie, but then what?

its great to see engineering and innovation is still alive and well,

Haven't seen any innovation for decades, we're still using pistons ffs, all that seems to happen is they include more electrickery and gadgets that just stop working after a few years anyway.  They've only refined the trusty internal combustion engine over the years, no true innovation.  I'd have thought we'd all be driving jet engined motors by now. Rant over. Yeah i am pissed, long story.

Red3 wrote: its great to see engineering and innovation is still alive and well, Haven't seen any innovation for decades, we're still using pistons ffs, all that seems to happen is they include more electrickery and gadgets that just stop working after a few years anyway.  They've only refined the trusty internal combustion engine over the years, no true innovation.  I'd have thought we'd all be driving jet engined motors by now. Rant over. Yeah i am pissed, long story.

Pissed so early in the day?

The Fastest wrote: Sorry Robbie, but then what?

When you've hosted the picture you want to use, then write down the URL i.e. http://www.bmwmovies.net/ - http://www.bmwmovies.net/ picture/number/etc.

Then type the URL in the signature box in you profile settings.

Just mess around with it you'll work it out after a while 

I'm sure someone can give a better explanation than mine BTW

Pissed so early in the day?

Yeah, i've had to stop drinking now though, boss has just come in, have to go for a walk...

Robbie Bradford wrote: Heads-up display in a roadcar = innovation.

It's in fighter aircraft aswell but i'm talkin' about road cars.

Robbie Bradford wrote: Robbie Bradford wrote: Heads-up display in a roadcar = innovation. It's in fighter aircraft aswell

exactly...so just bolting it into a car isn't innovative imo. I'd say abs was innovative though.

Dergside wrote: ASC, DSC, active headlights, etc. - all examples of innovation.  Just because they are electronic solutions rather than mechanical ones doesn't make them less innovative.

Correct.

All these applications have been around for yonks, but the fact they've made their way to cars isn't innovation per se.

HUDs have been on Corvettes for around 15 years now (give or take a few yrs). ABS was developed on WW2 planes in the 40s, and a mechanical version made its way into Jensen Interceptors in the 60s. I do agree it is a fantastic thing to have in a car though.

While I suppose, breaking out the thesaurus, innovation is "change, invention, feature, fad, novelty" etc, I don't consider it innovation unless there is a bit of a revolution to established methods of doing things.

Variable capacity engines (being developed apace by Saab), active ride (too costly and heavy for benefits), development in efficencies of power supplies (Prius, Lexus RX300h etc.. though fossil fuel is still the generator of the electric power), new materials in car manufacture leading to reduced weight, better recycling etc), even adaptive cruise control and the natural evolution to managed high-speed motorway work.

This is true innovation in my opinion. The rest is a bunch of engineers who have approached the envelope and rather try to push it, have focused on .... stupidity in alot of cases (Strong words I know). I mean, wipers on a VW Phaeton that lift themselves every 2nd sweep to equalise wear on both sides of the rubber... would you be bothered, either as a wiper development engineer, or as a prospective purchaser? Particularly as said Phaeton is 2,300kg, a whopping 600kg heavier than an Audi A8!

HUD is a good development, ABS, stabilty control etc are also relevant (as long as u can shut the TCS, DSC etc off for a bit of messing ) but alot of other stuff is carp.

Rant over! But someone needs to grab the industry by the collar and get them to reduce weight and improve efficiency more.

As a kind of related item, did anyone read this weeks Autocar letter of the week? A bloke basically saying that TVR, lotus et al can build a 150mph+ car with minimal gadgets, that weighs 1,100kg or less, and still passes relevent safety legislation. So why don't they build a simple, light, quick 2de saloon and revive the days of the E30 M3 etc.. great thought, isn't it? Imagine Lotus building one using a modular Hydro-formed platform with windup windows, simple heater, seats for 4, an S2000 2.2L V-tec motor and weighing around 1,150kg. Some machine...

Anyway, I'm out the gap - enjoy the Bank holiday everyone - drive safely! 

T.J. wrote: Rant over! But someone needs to grab the industry by the collar and get them to reduce weight and improve efficiency more. As a kind of related item, did anyone read this weeks Autocar letter of the week? A bloke basically saying that TVR, lotus et al can build a 150mph+ car with minimal gadgets, that weighs 1,100kg or less, and still passes relevent safety legislation. So why don't they build a simple, light, quick 2de saloon and revive the days of the E30 M3 etc.. great thought, isn't it? Imagine Lotus building one using a modular Hydro-formed platform with windup windows, simple heater, seats for 4, an S2000 2.2L V-tec motor and weighing around 1,150kg. Some machine... Anyway, I'm out the gap - enjoy the Bank holiday everyone - drive safely!

TJ

The easiest way to reduce or control weight is to make mechanical systems electronic (in theory it should also improve reliability because there are fewer moving parts - still a bit early for that to be true in practice). 

True, Lotus and so on can build light cars, but not cheaply.  Mass manufacturers could also build them, but few consumers are willing to pay the cost of achieveing it. 

You are also right about some of the things mentioned having been around in some shape or form for some time, but in many cases the earlier versions were far less "complete".  The Ferguson four wheel drive system that also incorporated mechanical abs on the Jensen Interceptor was relatively crude and ultimately not entirely reliable.  Would anyone today tolerate abs that "might" work? 

The first manufacturer to fit abs as standard to all the cars in a particular model was Ford with the Granada in 1985.  There has been a gradual adoption until the point where it is now virtually unversal.

If by innovation you mean "revolutionary" then you are right, there are very few truely original innovations, but refining existing technology and identifying new applications are equally innovative.  The other thing about revolutionary ideas is tha they are seldom faultless or can't be improved and need to be refined to a level where they are sufficiently reliable and cost effective to be useful.  Like with abs.  It started as a niche solution until innovations occurred that refined it to the extent that it was robust enough and cost effective for wider deplooyment.

The company I work for designed "accelerometers" years ago for use in air bags - detecting the g forces that go with a crash and calculating whether it is sufficiently serious to trigger deployment of the bags).  The same technology was then used in car security systems to detect if your car has been moved, jacked up (to rob your wheels) or lifted (on to a trailer to be stolen).  This wasn't new technology in the second case, but it was a new application and therefore innovative.

@ Dergside - *phew* some reply!

Lotus et al are not cheap, but mass production brings economies of scale that I'd be hoping would bring the cost down.. a bit simplistic I know.

I agree the first introduction of ABS & 4wd on road vehicles wasn't complete, and that significant refinements of the technologies, alot to do with electronics and processing speeds, have improved them beyond recognition. But innovation has to start somewhere I suppose..

Refinement of existing technology isn't innovation per se, but as you say new applications of existing technology is, if it brings real benefits and not gimmicks. So I think we're kind of singing from the same hymn sheet.

For example BMWs MINI uses the ABS sensors to determine if a wheel is flat by monitoring the rolling radius of all 4 tyres, and detecting if any tyres pressure drops below 70% of normal (as set by the datum of the other 3 tyres I presume). That's innovative compared to Renaults having a sender located inside the tyre to monitor actual pressure..