Moral of the story is?

Customer’s story. (not mine – I drive a 728i amongst other old bangers)
The owner of a 2009 520d gets a low oil level warning, so he puts in about half a litre of oil and it goes out. A few weeks later, he takes the car for a service to the local dealer. He is informed by phone that there is too much oil in the engine, and it will have to come out. He agrees and subsequently is charged around £75 for this. He assumes that in view of the high cost, new oil replaced the oil removed. It was not - the old oil was replaced.
A few weeks later he notices that the car is lacking power and takes it to the dealer to sort out problem. He is told that his turbo has failed due to poor quality /dirty oil and will cost over £9000 to replace.
Furthermore, despite the fact that the car has a long, mileage independent warranty, that he will have to pay for it.

The customer objects on the grounds that the car has always been serviced by the dealer since new, on time, and the service record agrees. He appeals to BMW customer services and is told that it is at the discretion of the dealer whether he does a repair under warranty or not. He also states that the oil that he put in the car was top quality and of the correct grade and asks for his car back. The dealer demands a payment in excess of £2000 from the customer to cover his diagnostics costs, or he will not release the car.

Dealer’s Story
Dealer grapevine says that a download of the cars computer record indicates that the car has on two occasions had its odometer rewound electronically. Why this should be necessary is not known. Because of this, and the fact that the customer was arguing that the oil should have been replaced, when it was not, the oil is sent to a local manufacturer for analysis. This is not authorised by the customer. Outcome of this is not available.
At the end of the day, dealer stands by his refusal to do the repair under warranty and demands a £2000+ fee for his costs and to release the car.

My questions.
1.     Does a 2009 525i have the capability of knowing that the odometer has been rewound electronically?
2.     What difference should it make to the warranty decision if the clock has been rewound if the warranty is not mileage dependent?
3.      How long has it been at the discretion of a dealer to decide whether a warranty claim is valid or not?
4.     Should a dealer, when removing oil from a car engine on the grounds that it is overfull, replace it with new oil, or with the old oil?
5.     Is the £2000+ reasonable for diagnosing a faulty turbo?


Arguments for and against each side please.

Howard wrote: 1.     Does a 2009 525i have the capability of knowing that the odometer has been rewound electronically? 2.     What difference should it make to the warranty decision if the clock has been rewound if the warranty is not mileage dependent? 3.      How long has it been at the discretion of a dealer to decide whether a warranty claim is valid or not? 4.     Should a dealer, when removing oil from a car engine on the grounds that it is overfull, replace it with new oil, or with the old oil? 5.     Is the £2000+ reasonable for diagnosing a faulty turbo?

1. I recall hearing that the digital milages are stored in three places within the car (ECU, radio and LCM). Not sure if this is correct. I also recall hearing that a dot would appear in the odometer should it be misaligned between the three.
2. I suppose it would but it also depends on who rewound it and when the warranty was offered. I'm sure that its in the warranty docs but a solicitor would be best able to advise. As the warranty was milage independent, surely the possibility of it being clocked is irrelevant.
3. Surely it would be at the discretion of the warranty provider ultimately.
4. If overfilled, I would simply remove some of the oil and not all of it. I'm not aware of any reasons to drain it completely. I know that overfilling can cause the oil to froth but I don't think this damages the oil.
5. 2k to diagnose a blown turbo and drain some oil? They are taking the mick!

It seems very odd indeed Howard.
However, your friend presumably has had no reason to clock the car but this may have been a nisunderstanding of what the dealer meant.
However, 2k to diagnose a blown turbo is still waaaay too much.

Andrew Rolland wrote: I have seen a couple of adverts recently fixed to lamp posts at roundabouts for "Digital Mileage Correction" call 0141 ....somewhere in Glasgow.  Why would you want to digitally correct your mileage in the first place?  That's something I've never understood. Maybe if you are a dodgy geezer and you are flogging it but that isn't the case here.

It's someone advertising a clocking service but using words that attempt to make it sound legitimate.

These people should be shut down.

Peter Fenwick wrote: Andrew Rolland wrote: I would want to know why the dealer put old oil back in if it was in for a service, presumably it was in for an oil service, why else would the dealer be poking about the oil level?  I missed this point originally. If the car was in for a service then it would have had new oil anyway. Unless it was in for a reason other than a service?

Ah but the E60 is all condition based servicing (CBS).  The iDrive tells you when various things need changing.  Oil, Vehicle check (the new version of the old Insp II), Microfilters, Brake fluid, Brake pads etc etc.

It could have been that the car was in for a 'service' of say Microfilters or brake fluid renewal and the dealer wouldn't go anywhere near the oil as the CBS tells them that the oil was fine as in it is not due for replacement. 

My local dealer (BMW) does a 'scan' of the diagnostics (~£20) as part of any service regardless of what the car is in for.  I'm thinking they could have scanend the car anyway and it told them that the oil was slightly high..... 

I think BMW would use their diagnostic computers to reset the service icons so the car gets plugged in regardless of what it's in for.

Wow what a story!  I'm guessing the e60 520d doesn't have a dipstick!

Who's telling the whole truth and nothing but the truth here?

I once took my e30 in (to a main dealer in Camden) for a free MOT and the next day was presented with a list of problems to be rectified.  I asked how many were essential and I was told all of them and the list hit the floor.  I forget if I paid for the MOT or just walked out.  But I have never taken my cars to a main dealer for a service since and BTW nothing on that list was picked up at the next MOT station (it passed) and nothing on that list ever gave any problems.

I had that car chipped and part of the package was a 'performance' air filter.  I worked on a very dusty site and one weekend drove west on the M4 flooring it caused the engine to try and swallow the clogged filter.  The womble from the AA plugged in his ladybird screen and couldn't figure it out.  I was trailered to my indy who said it took ages to figure out because of the b steer from the womble and it was just the air filter standard fitted but could I pay for more than 1o mins of labour and the paper filter?

£2,000 to find a fault? Well oil tests in a lab a so expensive, hours of the manager pouring over the warranty clauses and plugging in a computer that is supposed to tell you what is wrong anyway!

Did I understand correctly? This person bought the car from the dealer and got it serviced there. The dealer then chooses this moment to say Oh by the way you've been clocking your car.

I can't believe a main dealer missing the opportunity to charge for new oil.  I can't believe any garage draining a car and then putting it back in!

I note that despite £2,000 they can't be clear as to whether the oil is dirty or of poor quality.  That said if the turbo has blown I would expect the oil to be a bit dirty!

This person needs legal advice to secure the release of his car, to obtain a written inspection report from another reputable specialist to answer the allegations and further legal advice to obtain redress.  Assuming that is he isn't a double amputee.

But remeber guys, we haven't heard the full story and as the OP suspected, there may have been a bit of economy with the truth.

I can't remember if the 520d I was subjected too had a dipstick, but how many folk actually use it to check their oil level?

The E60s use condition based servicing and long life oil.  If the oil didn't need changing then the dealer would be well within their rights to put it back in the sump.  IMO this kinda defeats the point but if it doesn't need changing, then you don't have to change it, makes the dealer fell more generous....

If you don't like a certain BMW dealer try another one.

I went to the old Henry Bros in Glasgow, got a list of fault points as long as my arm (inc worn front discs and pads), fixed the majority of faults, it went back in their for another service 10,000 miles later (with the same discs and pads) and didn't get any faults.  I enquired as to why they hadn't picked up on the discs and pads this time when they had 10,000 miles ago..and they couldn't answer. Aye, busted!

The new condition based servicing on the E60's and others stops this kinda behaviour from dealers.  The BMW dealer (Fairbairs) I now go to has always been straight with me and I haven't been plauged with numerous "faults"....but maybe this car is just better?

This sounds like a cowboys job? Not sure if anyone would be
hassled to go thru the pain and expense of legal system to
get these cowboys sorted.

Main dealers are out to make money first and foremost and sadly customer service appears fairly low on the list of priorities. I've had plenty of bad experiences and I would only go back if I had a warranty to claim on (except for parts of course).

They seem to be filled with smooth talking blokes in shiney suits who are good at extracting cash and poor at rectifying problems.

 

My local BMW dealer is full of them. When I go to the parts department I get to listen in on the conversations the sales/services reps have with customers and it would put me off using them for life.

Still doesn't explain the dealer wanting £2,000 to release the car.

So in otherwords the owner got his comuppance!

Ignore a cars needs and you are on your own when the engine blows up.

A colleague's daughter had a Corsa which blew it's head gasket.  Oil and water levels hadn't been checked since she moved out from Daddy's house (he used to do it and told her to then do it) and then ignored the temp gauge heading to the red and was then suprised to hear that the engine was then only suitable for making into baked bean tin cans.