Bavarian-Board.co.uk - BMW Owners Discussion Forum Homepage
Forum Home Forum Home > Technical & Model Specific Forums > BMW ///M Power
  New Posts New Posts RSS Feed - DSC or Clutch
  FAQ FAQ  Forum Search   Register Register  Login Login

Forum LockedDSC or Clutch
 Post Reply Post Reply
Author
Message
  Topic Search Topic Search  Topic Options Topic Options
Garythefish View Drop Down
Newbie
Newbie


Joined: 11-October-2006
Location: East London
Status: Offline
Points: 11 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Garythefish Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: DSC or Clutch
    Posted: 21-November-2006 at 12:08
As a newbie here I have a 2001 S54 Z3 ///M Roadster.

My question is this -

Damp road conditions last night, fancied a roadtest of the DSC while the roads were quiet,

1.) 15MPH turning right, DSC on, 2nd gear,3000 rpm, dumped the clutch and floored the gas, lots of revs and no wheelspin, good control but a funny smell.

2.) 15MPH straight line, DSC off, 2nd gear,3000 rpm, dumped the clutch and floored the gas, lots of revs and no wheelspin, good control and a funny smell.

3.) 10MPH straight line, 4th gear, floored the gas,car pulls steady with no clutch slip

What is the smell?

and it wasn't coming from my trousers

Gazza.

Back to Top
Sponsored Links


Back to Top
flyingalexf68 View Drop Down
Really Senior Member II
Really Senior Member II
Avatar

Joined: 01-April-2006
Location: 53°19’59,6°14’56
Status: Offline
Points: 2581 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote flyingalexf68 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21-November-2006 at 12:20

Sounds like your clutch. Try it again with DSC off and don't press the clutch in. Just floor the gas. The rears should spin up and kick the tail out. (I do this most mornings on a lovely tight uphill right hander near where I live). Clutch could be a little weak though if you're only revving to 3000.

EDIT: On reading your post again, only do this while turning and give a sharp turn in. If you try spin the wheels while the car is moving it will just fry the clutch. Or you can spin the wheels from a standstill.



Edited by flyingalexf68
1995 e36 3.0 M3 Coupe, Daytona Violet, AP Racing BBK, CCFL Angel Eyes, M3 Spoiler, M-Tec 3 Steering Wheel.   
2000 530d Steptronic, Poverty Spec, 18" Alloys.
Back to Top
Garythefish View Drop Down
Newbie
Newbie


Joined: 11-October-2006
Location: East London
Status: Offline
Points: 11 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Garythefish Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21-November-2006 at 14:56

REPLIES FROM OTHER FORUMS

"My betting is that it is also being affected by you still having the normal Clutch Delay Valve in place ...


The Clutch Delay Valve (CDV) is a one-way restrictor installed by the factory between the clutch slave cylinder and clutch master cylinder. It "delays" the engagement of the clutch, much like old record players used a damped tone-arm to gently lower the needle onto the surface of a record.

Because of this valve, no matter how quickly you lift your foot off the clutch pedal, the clutch engages the flywheel at a constant (slow) rate."

< style =text/css>
AND

"you have to take into account that you run an S54 M Roadster . . . .

Fly by wire throttle - therefore full throttle on your foot does not necessarily mean full throttle/full power/full opening on the butterflies - the DME sorts that one out for you - unlike the S50 which has a wired throttle and arguably even more character than the S54! "



Edited by Garythefish
Back to Top
Mallorcaman View Drop Down
Really Senior Member I
Really Senior Member I
Avatar

Joined: 13-December-2004
Location: Mallorca, Spain
Status: Offline
Points: 254 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mallorcaman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21-November-2006 at 21:28
Does it smell of fish?
MALLORCAMAN
Putting the ///M in Mallorca
Back to Top
flyingalexf68 View Drop Down
Really Senior Member II
Really Senior Member II
Avatar

Joined: 01-April-2006
Location: 53°19’59,6°14’56
Status: Offline
Points: 2581 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote flyingalexf68 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22-November-2006 at 14:11

That could be it too Gary. But I will say that even in my old tech '95 M3 it will burn the clutch if I dump it while already moving. I did this by accident (well, in frustration) a while ago after being annoyed by a car in front. As I was going past it at around 10mph I revved the engine up (to let them know that I was pi$$ed) and dumped the clutch out in second gear (hoping to spin the wheels and tear off into the distance being all irresponsible like the boy racer they would have thought I was anyway). The clutch just slipped and the engine revved right up but I went nowhere. And yes the smell was awful. Needless to say I won't do that again!

 
1995 e36 3.0 M3 Coupe, Daytona Violet, AP Racing BBK, CCFL Angel Eyes, M3 Spoiler, M-Tec 3 Steering Wheel.   
2000 530d Steptronic, Poverty Spec, 18" Alloys.
Back to Top
T.J. View Drop Down
Bavarian-Board Contributor
Bavarian-Board Contributor
Avatar

Joined: 22-September-2003
Location: Cork, Ireland
Status: Offline
Points: 2332 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote T.J. Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22-November-2006 at 15:29
all this talk of people dumping clutches in 2nd at walking pace makes me weep. Do ye have no mechanical sympathy? This kind of driving is just not needed, even to 'test' a DSC system.
Mazda 6 MPS
S1 Elise 135 Sport
Alfa Romeo 159 Sportwagon


Formerly E39 TDS, E36 M3, E36 328i, E34 525i, E34 518i
Back to Top
T.J. View Drop Down
Bavarian-Board Contributor
Bavarian-Board Contributor
Avatar

Joined: 22-September-2003
Location: Cork, Ireland
Status: Offline
Points: 2332 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote T.J. Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22-November-2006 at 15:31

what size wheels & tyres are on the Z3?

Opps on re-reading it says tis a M-Roadster, so 17" on 235/45-ish sized tyres? Plenty of poke to kick the rear out in 1st, 2nd or 3rd without having to dump the clutch. To save further burned friction plates, here's EVOs Richard Meadens experiences of his Long Term M-Coupes DSC in 2002:

I usually relish the M Coupe's more hirsute handling attributes, but after inadvertently having a huge moment in it a few weeks back, I've begun to treat it with a bit more respect ΂- especially now that the roads are getting more slippery.

I was making a fast, third-gear exit from a roundabout onto a dual carriageway, young Bovingdon in the passenger seat nursing a sackful of quarter pounders for the evo night- shift, when the M Coupe's hitherto hunkered-down tail snapped around in vicious fashion. Only a hasty McFlurry of opposite lock saved us from burying the Beemer's beak into the barriers.

I wouldn't have minded, but I hadn't touched the ASR traction control button. Subsequent experimentation has revealed that the system reins things in smartly at low speed but is slow to react to the 3.2-litre motor's ample power at higher speeds in slick conditions. Consequently you can find yourself looking out of the side window unexpectedly. Roll on winter. Not.

In a masochistic way, though, this is the essence of M Coupe motoring. It's raw, rough-edged and mighty, mighty quick. Its chassis is certainly crude in comparison to the iron-fisted M3, but there's a lot to be said for a car that keeps you on your toes. There isn't another evo long-termer I'd rather be running.

 



Edited by T.J.
Mazda 6 MPS
S1 Elise 135 Sport
Alfa Romeo 159 Sportwagon


Formerly E39 TDS, E36 M3, E36 328i, E34 525i, E34 518i
Back to Top
flyingalexf68 View Drop Down
Really Senior Member II
Really Senior Member II
Avatar

Joined: 01-April-2006
Location: 53°19’59,6°14’56
Status: Offline
Points: 2581 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote flyingalexf68 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22-November-2006 at 15:40
M Roadster has big wide 17's to fill the big wide arches.
1995 e36 3.0 M3 Coupe, Daytona Violet, AP Racing BBK, CCFL Angel Eyes, M3 Spoiler, M-Tec 3 Steering Wheel.   
2000 530d Steptronic, Poverty Spec, 18" Alloys.
Back to Top
Garythefish View Drop Down
Newbie
Newbie


Joined: 11-October-2006
Location: East London
Status: Offline
Points: 11 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Garythefish Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22-November-2006 at 16:49

My point is that the DSC may be faulty, as in my point No. 2, DSC turned off and still no wheelspin on a damp road just clutch slip, surely Michelin PS2 tyres dont have that much grip?

 

Gazza.
Back to Top
T.J. View Drop Down
Bavarian-Board Contributor
Bavarian-Board Contributor
Avatar

Joined: 22-September-2003
Location: Cork, Ireland
Status: Offline
Points: 2332 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote T.J. Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23-November-2006 at 10:14

Why don't you just roll at 1000rpm in 1st gear with the clutch engaged fully, then nail it? On a damp road my M3 will spin the rear wheels, so I'd imagine yours would too. If that's not working, go to a big open space, and do the same while turning gently (be ready for a jab of corrective lock on this one!).

Or put one wheel on grass and drive off. Or gravel. It should be pretty easy to establish if it is working or not I would think.
Mazda 6 MPS
S1 Elise 135 Sport
Alfa Romeo 159 Sportwagon


Formerly E39 TDS, E36 M3, E36 328i, E34 525i, E34 518i
Back to Top
Garythefish View Drop Down
Newbie
Newbie


Joined: 11-October-2006
Location: East London
Status: Offline
Points: 11 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Garythefish Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24-November-2006 at 17:43
I'll try it tonight
Back to Top
Kin Mak View Drop Down
Bavarian-Board Contributor
Bavarian-Board Contributor
Avatar

Joined: 09-April-2005
Location: Dublin, Ireland
Status: Offline
Points: 1691 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Kin Mak Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27-November-2006 at 00:03

Originally posted by Mallorcaman Mallorcaman wrote:

Does it smell of fish?

LOL...

Sound like your clutch is slipping mate... DSC won't create a smell, clutch slipping will.
KinMak.com - Elara Online
Back to Top
Ben O Brien View Drop Down
Really Senior Member II
Really Senior Member II
Avatar

Joined: 12-August-2004
Location: Limerick,Ireland
Status: Offline
Points: 1205 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ben O Brien Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-December-2006 at 11:47

Does DSC apply brakes? If so when it kicks in and your on full power you have the engine fighting the brakes and the weakest link will slip i.e. the clutch, Do you notice any other slippage under "normal" driving, simple test is to drive along at maybe 30mph in third and push in the clutch and give it a raise in revs by maybe 1500revs and let the clutch out, the revs should promptly return to the right revs for that speed and gear, if they stay the same and die slowly its your clutch slipping.
99' 740iL   
99' 728i Sport
98' E39 M5 - Avus Blue, Dec Car!
96' M3 Saloon - Estoril Blue
94' M3 3.0 Convertible
91' E34 M5 - 3.6, Macau Blue

*E36 M3's Breaking*
Back to Top
 Post Reply Post Reply
  Share Topic   

Forum Jump Forum Permissions View Drop Down



This page was generated in 0.266 seconds.