Bavarian-Board.co.uk - BMW Owners Discussion Forum Homepage
Forum Home Forum Home > Regional & Specific Forums > Irish Forum
  New Posts New Posts RSS Feed - Horsepower figures; How close to manufacturers claim?
  FAQ FAQ  Forum Search   Register Register  Login Login

Forum LockedHorsepower figures; How close to manufacturers claim?
 Post Reply Post Reply Page  <123>
Author
Message
  Topic Search Topic Search  Topic Options Topic Options
Peter Fenwick View Drop Down
Bavarian-Board Contributor
Bavarian-Board Contributor
Avatar

Joined: 27-August-2003
Location: Lost somewhere in time...
Status: Offline
Points: 6484 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Peter Fenwick Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10-November-2006 at 08:56
Originally posted by US M3 US M3 wrote:

Originally posted by thepits thepits wrote:

Originally posted by kbannon kbannon wrote:

I had my old 320i on the rolling road in Enfield a few years back. Apart from a K&N panel filter the car was pretty much standard. It did However, need a good service.
Factory bhp is 129, I got 128!

Hmmm, sounds like a dodgy rolling-road to me!

Westward Engineering, Its probably the most accurate rolling road in Ireland and the UK.

That's quite a claim!

Entering an age of Austerity and now driving a Focus Diesel.
Back to Top
Sponsored Links


Back to Top
T.J. View Drop Down
Bavarian-Board Contributor
Bavarian-Board Contributor
Avatar

Joined: 22-September-2003
Location: Cork, Ireland
Status: Offline
Points: 2332 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote T.J. Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10-November-2006 at 09:03

I think what they do is test on the wheel under power, then measure drivetrain losses with wheels turning but with no engine engaged, and extrapolate from there. I'm sure someone with more familiarity in the systems can tidy that explanation up a bit!!

the E46 M3 has a sissy fit on a rolling road unless its a 4 wheel one with the front rollers matching the speed of the rears. Otherwise the engine management detects a speed diff between the front and the rear and restricts output somewhat. I've seen 2 E46s and same thing on both: run up to 320-odd bhp and then nowt more
Mazda 6 MPS
S1 Elise 135 Sport
Alfa Romeo 159 Sportwagon


Formerly E39 TDS, E36 M3, E36 328i, E34 525i, E34 518i
Back to Top
gjoconnor92 View Drop Down
Really Senior Member II
Really Senior Member II
Avatar
The eyes have it

Joined: 21-July-2003
Location: Kildare and Limerick, Ireland
Status: Offline
Points: 735 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gjoconnor92 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10-November-2006 at 10:25

http://www.dynamometer.fsnet.co.uk/power-losses-flywheel-BHP .htm

From the site previously given explains how flywheel is derived from road wheel figures.

Killian I am still enjoying that 127bhp you had measured on the 320
Gerard O'Connor

1989 E30 320i for track day use
1972 2002 competition car project (delayed!!)
Sheane Formula Vee
My e-mail
Back to Top
gstonesE4620i View Drop Down
Groupie
Groupie
Avatar

Joined: 24-October-2006
Location: wicklow
Status: Offline
Points: 77 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gstonesE4620i Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10-November-2006 at 11:57

i used the lads in ashford or rathnew with the mazda and it was one little horse down on the manufc rating. from 110hp to 109hp at the wheels.

i did trust them but it was a strange feeling knowing that someone else is ragging your baby.

trackdayperformance i think was the name.



Edited by gstonesE4620i
what do you mean it was unexpected, you should have expected it!
Back to Top
Andyboy View Drop Down
Banned User
Banned User
Avatar

Joined: 04-June-2003
Status: Offline
Points: 707 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Andyboy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10-November-2006 at 12:24
A perfect 3.2 M3 Evo engine, running 100%
(compressions, valve clearances, plus, coils etc) on
an ENGINE dyno and running on 100 octane fuel will
always deliver 321 bhp.
On an iffy rolling road with imperfect calibration and
an imperfect M3 running on 95 RON in need of a
good service will drop a good 20 bhp. This is where
all that rubbish about how 'Evos never do 321 bhp'
comes from. They most certainly do, but only when in
perfect condition and using the right fuel.

I've found that double Vanos engines deliver a lot
more power than the single vanos ones -
considering the exhaust vanos was supposedly for
emissions it's a bit odd. Sohlman's Dad has a 528i
which delivers well over the 193 bhp quoted - it's not
far off the 231 bhp the 530i delivers. This is also a
double vanos car so a pattern emerges.

BMW, like all German manufacturers must
accurately state horsepower readings or face a huge
fine and a public dressing down from the ADAC. If a
car is supposed to give 150 bhp, that means a
minimum of 150 bhp. ADAC are contantly borrowing
cars and doing power checks.
Back to Top
Andrew Rolland View Drop Down
Moderator Group
Moderator Group
Avatar
Go away rain

Joined: 19-August-2004
Location: Scotland
Status: Offline
Points: 6579 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Andrew Rolland Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10-November-2006 at 12:47

thanks TJ that explains it.

Andrew
Be exclusive and drive a Petrol 5 Series!

Current
'13 62 F10 535i MSport Auto

Previous
'04 04 E60 545i SE Auto
'03 53 E60 545i SE Auto (Stolen)
'98 S E39 523i SE Auto
Back to Top
kbannon View Drop Down
Admin Group
Admin Group
Avatar
E39 525i Sport Individual

Joined: 09-October-2002
Location: 64 Zoo Lane
Status: Offline
Points: 15508 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote kbannon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10-November-2006 at 13:39
Originally posted by gjoconnor92 gjoconnor92 wrote:

Killian I am still enjoying that 127bhp you had measured on the 320


128bhp not 127!
That 1 horse makes a huge difference when overtaking!
Current: 2009 E60 520d "Sport" tractor
Previous: 1989 E30 320i SE
1997 E39 523i
2003 E39 525i Sport Individual
Back to Top
T.J. View Drop Down
Bavarian-Board Contributor
Bavarian-Board Contributor
Avatar

Joined: 22-September-2003
Location: Cork, Ireland
Status: Offline
Points: 2332 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote T.J. Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10-November-2006 at 14:50
It does when you're trying to swerve around it, Killian!
Mazda 6 MPS
S1 Elise 135 Sport
Alfa Romeo 159 Sportwagon


Formerly E39 TDS, E36 M3, E36 328i, E34 525i, E34 518i
Back to Top
UJM3 View Drop Down
Really Senior Member I
Really Senior Member I
Avatar

Joined: 07-July-2005
Location: Dublin
Status: Offline
Points: 383 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote UJM3 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10-November-2006 at 16:35

I had mine in westward too, 288.7 bhp with a K&N panel filter, so imo its accurate.

Evo magazine has taken to RR the cars its tests and quotes the rr power alonside the quoted power iirc the tvr tuscan covertable was way off, as in less.
Back to Top
Daveco View Drop Down
Really Senior Member I
Really Senior Member I


Joined: 23-June-2006
Location: Dublin
Status: Offline
Points: 253 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Daveco Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13-November-2006 at 08:24
Lads had my '04 325 tested on Friday in Xtreme Autos Waterford-Came in at 200.3bhp! This was in 4th gear at 115mph. Torque also came in at 183lb ft, 3 above what BMW say. The guy who did the test said if he ran it in fifth he could have got up to 204-5hp but I didn't want to push it. The 325 is running on standard fuel with no mods. Pretty chuffed!
past-01 318ci auto, '01 318ci
present-'04 325ci sport
future-no house and a 5 car garage
Back to Top
gjoconnor92 View Drop Down
Really Senior Member II
Really Senior Member II
Avatar
The eyes have it

Joined: 21-July-2003
Location: Kildare and Limerick, Ireland
Status: Offline
Points: 735 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gjoconnor92 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13-November-2006 at 10:46

Don't forget that other way to increase efective horsepower

Weight

If a 1200kg car has 240bhp (5kg per bhp) throwing out your 80kg passenger is worth 16bph

At the track days, some might have noticed people evicting spare wheels, tools etc. to improve power to weight ratio

 
Gerard O'Connor

1989 E30 320i for track day use
1972 2002 competition car project (delayed!!)
Sheane Formula Vee
My e-mail
Back to Top
stephenperry View Drop Down
Bavarian-Board Contributor
Bavarian-Board Contributor
Avatar

Joined: 20-April-2004
Location: Elgin
Status: Offline
Points: 7213 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote stephenperry Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13-November-2006 at 19:39

Originally posted by Daveco Daveco wrote:

Lads had my '04 325 tested on Friday in Xtreme Autos Waterford-Came in at 200.3bhp! This was in 4th gear at 115mph. Torque also came in at 183lb ft, 3 above what BMW say. The guy who did the test said if he ran it in fifth he could have got up to 204-5hp but I didn't want to push it. The 325 is running on standard fuel with no mods. Pretty chuffed!

very few cars will hit the rev-limiter in fifth, it depends if fifth is a direct top gear or an overdrive, if it's an overdrive then i don't think there would be no point in changing up since maximum power is achieved in fourth, if it's direct then he should have changed up

    2007 Ford Mondeo 2.0 TDCI Titanium X Auto
    1983 Ford Sierra XR4i
    2000 Alpina B10 3.3 #118
    1999 BMW 323Ci
    1995 BMW 318i SE
    1994 Vauxhall Omega 2.0 GLS
    1995 Ford Mondeo 1.8 LX
    1990 Honda Concerto 1.6 EX
    1986 Ford Orion 1.6 GL
    1989 Ford Fiesta 1.1 Firefly
Back to Top
stephenperry View Drop Down
Bavarian-Board Contributor
Bavarian-Board Contributor
Avatar

Joined: 20-April-2004
Location: Elgin
Status: Offline
Points: 7213 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote stephenperry Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13-November-2006 at 19:40
an impressive result, regardless

    2007 Ford Mondeo 2.0 TDCI Titanium X Auto
    1983 Ford Sierra XR4i
    2000 Alpina B10 3.3 #118
    1999 BMW 323Ci
    1995 BMW 318i SE
    1994 Vauxhall Omega 2.0 GLS
    1995 Ford Mondeo 1.8 LX
    1990 Honda Concerto 1.6 EX
    1986 Ford Orion 1.6 GL
    1989 Ford Fiesta 1.1 Firefly
Back to Top
gjoconnor92 View Drop Down
Really Senior Member II
Really Senior Member II
Avatar
The eyes have it

Joined: 21-July-2003
Location: Kildare and Limerick, Ireland
Status: Offline
Points: 735 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gjoconnor92 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13-November-2006 at 20:04

Hi Stephen

On a road most cars will not hit max revs in fifth due to weight drag etc.

These do not apply on a rolling road so an indicated speed higher than what could ever be got in real life should be possible.

Maybe there is a limit to the maximum roller speed on rolling roads.

Theoretically, should maximum power be measureable in all gears, or is this another limitation of rolling roads rather than the car
Gerard O'Connor

1989 E30 320i for track day use
1972 2002 competition car project (delayed!!)
Sheane Formula Vee
My e-mail
Back to Top
stephenperry View Drop Down
Bavarian-Board Contributor
Bavarian-Board Contributor
Avatar

Joined: 20-April-2004
Location: Elgin
Status: Offline
Points: 7213 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote stephenperry Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13-November-2006 at 20:32

I stand corrected, thanks Gerard


    2007 Ford Mondeo 2.0 TDCI Titanium X Auto
    1983 Ford Sierra XR4i
    2000 Alpina B10 3.3 #118
    1999 BMW 323Ci
    1995 BMW 318i SE
    1994 Vauxhall Omega 2.0 GLS
    1995 Ford Mondeo 1.8 LX
    1990 Honda Concerto 1.6 EX
    1986 Ford Orion 1.6 GL
    1989 Ford Fiesta 1.1 Firefly
Back to Top
flyingalexf68 View Drop Down
Really Senior Member II
Really Senior Member II
Avatar

Joined: 01-April-2006
Location: 53°19’59,6°14’56
Status: Offline
Points: 2581 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote flyingalexf68 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13-November-2006 at 22:20

Will a 325 do 155mph? If so it will hit the limiter. My old 2.2 Z3 happily hit the rev limiter in 5th gear on the (empty) road. 139mph and still charging hard. It needed another gear.

Thats a very good result Dave. You can be sure your car is running right anyway. See you at the next track day no doubt.

1995 e36 3.0 M3 Coupe, Daytona Violet, AP Racing BBK, CCFL Angel Eyes, M3 Spoiler, M-Tec 3 Steering Wheel.   
2000 530d Steptronic, Poverty Spec, 18" Alloys.
Back to Top
Daveco View Drop Down
Really Senior Member I
Really Senior Member I


Joined: 23-June-2006
Location: Dublin
Status: Offline
Points: 253 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Daveco Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14-November-2006 at 08:05
Cheers Alex/Stephen-I was very impressed with the result, the bloke who did the test said BMW are known for underestimating the power in their cars-He's had some 325's up and achieved 215hp-Now the big (slightly pointless) question is, am I quicker than a MK V Golf Gti??
past-01 318ci auto, '01 318ci
present-'04 325ci sport
future-no house and a 5 car garage
Back to Top
thepits View Drop Down
Moderator Group
Moderator Group
Avatar

Joined: 09-July-2003
Location: far far away
Status: Offline
Points: 10000473 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote thepits Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14-November-2006 at 08:42
Originally posted by Daveco Daveco wrote:

Now the big (slightly pointless) question is, am I quicker than a MK V Golf Gti??
Yes, pointless asking - of course you are
Cats know your every thought.

But don't care.
Back to Top
Daveco View Drop Down
Really Senior Member I
Really Senior Member I


Joined: 23-June-2006
Location: Dublin
Status: Offline
Points: 253 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Daveco Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14-November-2006 at 08:58
Thought so too...In fact why stop at a GTi?? Clearly in 911 territory now!  
past-01 318ci auto, '01 318ci
present-'04 325ci sport
future-no house and a 5 car garage
Back to Top
flyingalexf68 View Drop Down
Really Senior Member II
Really Senior Member II
Avatar

Joined: 01-April-2006
Location: 53°19’59,6°14’56
Status: Offline
Points: 2581 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote flyingalexf68 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14-November-2006 at 12:52

Originally posted by Daveco Daveco wrote:

Thought so too...In fact why stop at a GTi?? Clearly in 911 territory now!  

Steady on there now. 911? Boxster territory maybe.

1995 e36 3.0 M3 Coupe, Daytona Violet, AP Racing BBK, CCFL Angel Eyes, M3 Spoiler, M-Tec 3 Steering Wheel.   
2000 530d Steptronic, Poverty Spec, 18" Alloys.
Back to Top
 Post Reply Post Reply Page  <123>
  Share Topic   

Forum Jump Forum Permissions View Drop Down



This page was generated in 0.158 seconds.