Is O2 sensor needed with Alpha N |
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UweM3
Moderator Group Joined: 11-February-2003 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 5445 |
Posted: 27-September-2005 at 05:11 |
it's not really a dark art. You just need to know how an engine works. It's not just playing a little bit with the software and setting AFR's to a desired value.
You NEED some knowledge how an engine behaves and most certanly you need to understand what happens when you change "this and that". If you have never fiddled around with a carb and spark plug colours, I would recommend to get it done from a professional. You can easily blow you engine in one afternoon if you ignore the "messages" from you engine, wbo2 kit. There is a lot of reading on S14.net if you search for Alpha-N or MAXX. I am willing to show how mine is set up if we can agree on a location and date. |
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E61 520d, slow and buzzy but my wallet likes the mpg.....
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lancelotII
Really Senior Member II Joined: 24-November-2002 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 853 |
Posted: 27-September-2005 at 05:34 |
A slightly diverse question for those in the know, re the stock Narrow band sensor. In a nutshell, how does it equate to the mapping on your chip. (we are talking stock afm setup, but re-mapped). I know for a fact that mine is disconnected and that the car no longer has cats, so if it were connected, at what point is the engine using the info from the O2 sensor and where does the map come in. If the O2 sensor is determining the fuelling, I guess there is a cut off point (rpm) where it stops.
Roops |
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UweM3
Moderator Group Joined: 11-February-2003 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 5445 |
Posted: 27-September-2005 at 06:57 |
The lambda control works in some sort of "window" cycling up and down. So even if your value on the map isn't spot on, the Lambda is able to pull it to AFR14.7 as long the map value is in this window. As soon you hit the pedal to the metal, the Lambda control is OFF.
There is a switch point in your throttle switch. If you connect a multimeter to the Throttle switch you can measure it (approx 80% throttle). Only the idle contact makes a "click". The narrowband sensor is actually NOT able to precisely measure 14.7 AFR. The ECU does richen up till the sensor reads out of the Lambda 1, than immediately leans out till the sensor reads out of Lambda 1. This cyling up and down is than somewhere around Lambda 1 (very simple explained, hope it makes sense). In fact your car will run a little leaner on part throttle (depending on how it's mapped), than with Lambda control in place. What are you trying to achive Roops? I have a narrowband gauge fitted (very cheap kit, about a tenner) which is good enough to give you an idea what is happening if your map is out on part throttle. At least it shows you that your "trouble" area is lean or rich. |
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E61 520d, slow and buzzy but my wallet likes the mpg.....
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jonny 320is
Senior Member II Joined: 03-February-2005 Location: stafford Status: Offline Points: 240 |
Posted: 27-September-2005 at 07:18 |
So what WBO2 kit do people recommend and how much are they?
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chacha
Groupie Joined: 13-October-2003 Location: Basildon, Essex Status: Offline Points: 42 |
Posted: 27-September-2005 at 07:28 |
It Sounds like this is what you need: Innovate Motorsports XD-1 WideBand Lambda Gauge Kit is probably the best on the market at the moment This kit enables precise measurement of exhaust air/fuel ratio (AFR). The meter’s digital signal processing technology provides data on exactly how rich or lean an engine is running at any load. You can display output on the gauge and also feed third-party Engine Management system or Laptop etc. Let me know if you are interested as I can get a significant discount on this product. |
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UweM3
Moderator Group Joined: 11-February-2003 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 5445 |
Posted: 27-September-2005 at 07:38 |
I know one person for sure who needs one very soon.
Do you have a price? |
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E61 520d, slow and buzzy but my wallet likes the mpg.....
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lancelotII
Really Senior Member II Joined: 24-November-2002 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 853 |
Posted: 27-September-2005 at 08:09 |
Perfect Uwe. I am sure my car is running rich pretty much through the rev range. It's got that kind of fluffly throttle response from idle when it stutters and then goes, whereas if you bring the throttle in smoothly it's fine. I am just trying to figure where to start looking, I haven't even pulled the plugs yet, which I should do and I am suspecting that the temp sensor may be worth changing. I just want to understand what controls the mixture thereby trying to make sensible decisions on the best course of action. I could just give it to somebody, but I wan't to have a fiddle myself. Roops |
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jonny 320is
Senior Member II Joined: 03-February-2005 Location: stafford Status: Offline Points: 240 |
Posted: 27-September-2005 at 08:36 |
chacha, I'm very interested in this kit, let me know how much, that would be great. |
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chacha
Groupie Joined: 13-October-2003 Location: Basildon, Essex Status: Offline Points: 42 |
Posted: 27-September-2005 at 09:18 |
Discounted price for XD-1 Kit is £259.00 Including VAT. Next Day UK Delivery is £9.00. Feel free contact me if you have any questions. |
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UweM3
Moderator Group Joined: 11-February-2003 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 5445 |
Posted: 27-September-2005 at 09:35 |
is that together with the LC1 ? Fully standalone including sensor, cable etc? Edited by UweM3 |
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E61 520d, slow and buzzy but my wallet likes the mpg.....
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chacha
Groupie Joined: 13-October-2003 Location: Basildon, Essex Status: Offline Points: 42 |
Posted: 27-September-2005 at 09:42 |
Yes, This is what's in the box:
Thanks! |
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jonny 320is
Senior Member II Joined: 03-February-2005 Location: stafford Status: Offline Points: 240 |
Posted: 27-September-2005 at 09:53 |
sounds good to me, where do i sign?
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215DMX
Really Senior Member II Joined: 14-May-2003 Location: Croydon Status: Offline Points: 1780 |
Posted: 27-September-2005 at 10:46 |
Hi there Vano, mine is up and running, though I had
a little trouble in syncing it with the Motec due to a ground difference, I will have a comparison check soon to double check I'm seeing a true value. I think it is slightly biased. i.e it is showing a Lambda leaner than the engine is actually running, not y much though. Uwe, I believe the STD Lambda sensor (afm fitted etc) also cuts outs out above 4000 rpm as well as above 80% throttle. Dave |
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UweM3
Moderator Group Joined: 11-February-2003 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 5445 |
Posted: 27-September-2005 at 11:13 |
Nothing to do with revs. Throttle switch is the trigger. You won't do high revs on low throttle anyway. |
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E61 520d, slow and buzzy but my wallet likes the mpg.....
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chacha
Groupie Joined: 13-October-2003 Location: Basildon, Essex Status: Offline Points: 42 |
Posted: 27-September-2005 at 11:53 |
Hi Dave, |
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215DMX
Really Senior Member II Joined: 14-May-2003 Location: Croydon Status: Offline Points: 1780 |
Posted: 27-September-2005 at 13:01 |
Yeah, all done 'by the book', I put in new plugs as well and did some motorway runs but even when showing 0.98 - 1.00 Lambda the plug edges were still very 'sooty' for that reading. Dave |
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UweM3
Moderator Group Joined: 11-February-2003 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 5445 |
Posted: 27-September-2005 at 13:09 |
Sooty edges are caused by crusing along. Not enough heat
0.98 - 1.00 is still "rich" (sort off). You need to run 15 and slightly above to "clean" your exhaust. Or put your foot down. This will clean your plugs. For sure |
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E61 520d, slow and buzzy but my wallet likes the mpg.....
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215DMX
Really Senior Member II Joined: 14-May-2003 Location: Croydon Status: Offline Points: 1780 |
Posted: 27-September-2005 at 13:28 |
Oh, I know what your saying Uwe, it's just until I can
100% trust the gauge and it's input into the Motec, i'm reluctant to run 15's, I've got close between 3500-4000 rpm at cruising throttle, at 1.01 Lambda. I'm also not using Lambda control until I have this sorted either. From 1000rpm - 4000rpm, load sites 5%-80% are between 1.00 Lambda at the lower %'s to 0.97 towards 80%. Greater than 80% is +/- 0.94 Above 4000rpm goes up to 0.87 at 100% but i haven't been adjusting this and just left as Powerstation did it. Their target Lambda is very rich in the mid %'s and too lean >80% This is the only area i adjusted. BTW I find it far easier to work in Lambda rather than AFR as the reading has less fluctation. |
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Demlotcrew
Groupie Joined: 30-August-2005 Status: Offline Points: 64 |
Posted: 27-September-2005 at 15:55 |
Hi Chacha i will be needing one of these soon, will this offer still be around? Thanks Andrew |
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email: Andrew AT E30zone.co.uk | 323is | S14 ™ |
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chacha
Groupie Joined: 13-October-2003 Location: Basildon, Essex Status: Offline Points: 42 |
Posted: 27-September-2005 at 16:35 |
Yes, I should be able to provide it at discounted price for the forseable future. Just drop me a message when you decide to go for it. |
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