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Peter Fenwick View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20-June-2005 at 05:05

What an utter shambles.

The day the rule book becomes more important than the racing is the day the sport dies.

Apparently Ferrari were the only team to object to the chicaine. Have they forgotten that it's the public that pay for the sport. No racing = no spectators = no sponsors = no F1.

It might be a good thing though. This kind of occurance can only encourage the formation of a breakaway formula. A totally fresh start is what this sport needs.

Damn missed topgear, is it on again anytime this week?

 

 

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20-June-2005 at 05:41

 Ferrari are well aware that the public pays the piper, and have excellent memories----------Unlike it would seem the rest of the Teams and THE "Fans" A couple of race,s ago, Ferrari were having megga Problems with the set up and handling of their cars------------Problems????? and it was called Bridgestone Tyres, wrong Compound ++++.They withdrew the cars.

Who heard Ferrari requesting a change of course surface OR chicane,s???????????? the Michelin Runners laughed and said Tough mate . So!!!!!!!!! youre Surprised when ferrari stucked 2 fingers up, are you  

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20-June-2005 at 06:41

I'm not supprised.

The big difference is that if Ferrari don't race there will still be a race. The other bridgestone runners didn't have any problems. Also Bridgstone didn't come out and say "you can't race on these tyres"

Although the two occasions are centered around the same problem, there is an order of magnitude difference between the results. 

Although I appreciate Ferrari's stance it meant that there wasn't a race, or at least not a proper one. The people who got screwed were the paying public who bought tickets.

Paul Stoddard summed it up prefectly whern he said it's time to think about the sport and not the rules, or words to that effect, and he was a bridgestone runner who stood to gain from all the Michelin using teams not running.

Being right and justisfied is not going to stop the sport going under. 

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22-June-2005 at 12:27
Originally posted by Peter Fenwick Peter Fenwick wrote:

The big difference is that if Ferrari don't race there will still be a race.


So, it's one set of rules for Ferrari and one for every else, eh?        
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22-June-2005 at 16:05
Mosley 'wrecked US salvage talks'
Only two cars started the US Grand Prix following problems with Michelin tyres
Only the Ferraris, Minardis and Jordans started the US GP
The US Grand Prix fiasco could have been avoided but for the intervention of Formula One boss Max Mosley, Minardi boss Paul Stoddart has said.

Stoddart said most F1 teams had lost faith in Mosley - the president of F1's governing body the FIA - and repeated calls for his resignation.

He said Mosley resisted all attempts to solve the problem of Michelin being unable to guarantee its tyres' safety.

"Mosley failed in his duty so I have called for his resignation," he said.

"There is no question in my mind that the farce that occurred... at Indianapolis was the responsibility of the FIA president, Max Mosley, and compounded by the lack of support from (Ferrari boss) Jean Todt.

"Mosley refused to accept any of the solutions offered and that refusal was, I believe, politically motivated."

Minardi boss Paul Stoddart
It was evident Mosley had bullied the US Grand Prix promoter into submission and Bernie Ecclestone was powerless to intervene
Paul Stoddart
Stoddart's views come in a lengthy statement released by Minardi, which he says is an attempt to "provide a truthful account" of events at Indianapolis.

The race went ahead with just six cars after all the Michelin teams pulled out because their tyres' safety could not be guaranteed over a race distance.

The FIA has blamed Michelin and the teams - Renault, McLaren, Williams, Toyota, BAR, Sauber, Red Bull - and said they should have run at reduced speeds.

Mosley said inserting a chicane would have been "grossly unfair" to the teams using Bridgestone tyres, which were suffering no problems, as well as raising fresh safety and legal issues.

All the teams could face sanctions after being summoned to a meeting in Paris next week.

But Stoddart said the FIA's solution for the Michelin teams to run more slowly through the 200mph final corner "could, and probably would" have caused a "monumental accident".

Stoddart said nine of the 10 teams were then prepared to stage a non-championship race, without Ferrari, to ensure the crowd were entertained.

That too, he said, was ruled out by Mosley after discussions with F1's commercial supremo Bernie Ecclestone and others including McLaren boss Ron Dennis.

"To my total disgust, it was stated that Mosley had informed Mr Martin, the FIA's most senior representative in the USA, that if any kind of non-championship race was run, or any alteration made to the circuit, the US Grand Prix and indeed all FIA-regulated motorsport in the US would be under threat," said Stoddart.

Max Mosley, president of the FIA
Mosley is in the firing line over the US GP fiasco
"By now it was evident Mosley had bullied the US Grand Prix promoter into submission, Bernie Ecclestone was powerless to intervene and all efforts of the team principals, with the exception of Jean Todt, had failed to save the 2005 US Grand Prix," he said.

Stoddart said that "Minardi, the seven Michelin teams, Bernie Ecclestone and the promoters did not agree with Mr Mosley's tactics".

He added that those involved in the dicussions aimed at saving the race "felt and stated that Mosley had overstepped the mark and had no idea whatsoever of the gravity of the situation".

He said: "Michelin was responsible enough to admit that the problem was of their creation.

"When one considers that even the replacement, Barcelona-specification tyres that were shipped to IMS, when tested, apparently exhibited the same characteristics as those that originally failed, this clearly is a case of force majeure."

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23-June-2005 at 05:05

Originally posted by spokey spokey wrote:

Originally posted by Peter Fenwick Peter Fenwick wrote:

The big difference is that if Ferrari don't race there will still be a race.


So, it's one set of rules for Ferrari and one for every else, eh?        

Ah Spokey, I have seen you posting for a long time. Have you been away or just busy?

No, I'm not saying that. If the only team that had tyre problems was Williams, or any other team for that matter, I would take the same stance. If one team cannot race it is not the end of the world, if seven can't, it is.

Mind you wrt to testing it's one rule for ferrari and one for everyone else isn't it. Also don't Ferrari get a much bigger cut of the money than the other teams?

  

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25-June-2005 at 15:11

This could be interesting if it happens ?  

 

 

Click to enlarge

When The Mole returned from Indianapolis, he spent the first morning back in the office, working the phones. All hell had broken loose in the motor racing world.

Miss Pringle-Featherby (of the Berkshire Pringle-Featherbys) kept up a constant flow of cups of tea and Rich Tea biscuits but The Mole remained in a deep depression.

"It is a disaster," he moaned at one point.

"Oh, look on the bright side," said Penelope (Roedean). "If nothing else it will shake the tree and the dead wood will fall out."

"I am worried that the tree is so rotten that it will fall down," said The Mole. "How could they have been so stupid?"

"I prefer the word arrogance," said Penelope. "Total, blind arrogance."

The Mole nodded.

"I think it was a poker game that went wrong," he said. "I think Max Mosley really believed that the Michelin teams would back down at the last minute and race in the United States. He wanted them humiliated but he did not read the signs."

"How could he?" said Penelope. "He was sitting in an ivory tower in Europe, relying on telephone conversations. It was like playing poker with a blindfold. He bet the farm and he lost. And now we are moving on to the next hand and he needs to be a little more careful."

"Not very intelligent," said The Mole.

"No, Max is very smart," said Penelope. "He may be getting older but his brain is still working. The problem is arrogance. To imagine that you can do it all by telephone is astonishing."

"Well, it works in Australia," said The Mole.

"Yes," said Penelope, "but the opposition was not as frightening. Paul Stoddart is like a terrier pulling at your trouser-leg, taking on all the teams is battling a creature which wants to tear your heart out."

"Messy business," said The Mole.

There was a pause and then The Mole beckoned Penelope to him.

"Come here," he whispered, slightly alarming his deputy. "I don't want anyone else hearing this. The rebel teams are talking about driving their trucks right past Magny-Cours next week and not stopping until they get to Paul Ricard.

"Paul Ricard!" said Penelope.

"Shh," hissed The Mole.

"Well, that means... That means that Bernie Ecclestone is with the teams," she said. "Paul Ricard is his race track."

"His test track," corrected The Mole.

"So there would be 14 cars at Ricard?"

"Probably 16," said The Mole. "I guess Minardi would go with the rebels and switch to Michelin."

"And Jordan?"

"No one gives a damn about Jordan," said The Mole, coldly. "It would be a race for TV only. No spectators."

"And Magny-Cours?" said Penelope. "Max and Jean Todt can play I-Spy with the crowd."

"I Spy with my little eye, something beginning with E."

"Empty pit lane?" fired back Penelope.

They both smiled.

"That makes sense," Penelope said. "The major TV stations will go with The Bernard."

The Mole nodded.

"So this is the big showdown," she said.

"I think so," said The Mole. "It's just like the FISA-FOCA War of 1980-1981. 16 cars is not bad at all for a rebel race. And Ferrari has no sensible allies.

"What are they going to do? Buy some GP2 cars from Flavio, paint them red and let Michael Schumacher beat Heikki Kovalainen?"

"Well, actually Kovalainen beat him at the Race of Champions last winter," said Penelope.

"You know, this can only last a week or two," The Mole said. "This will get them all back to the negotiating table."

"Do you really think that Max and Bernie will turn on one another?"

"It looks that way, doesn't it?"

"Wow," said Penelope, "that is pretty nuclear as explosions go."

"Well," said The Mole, "Things are moving all the time and Bernie will always jump to what he believes is the winning side. If he jumps into bed with the manufacturers now, he will get a better deal in the long term, won't he?"

"Maybe," said Penelope. "But America is screwed for F1."

"No," said The Mole. "I think not. If you think about it, everyone is annoyed but if Tony George gives them free tickets next year and F1 serves them up Danica Patrick in a Williams and Scott Speed in a Renault, they are going to come back and watch. They just will."

"Even after Bernie called her a domestic appliance?" said Penelope.

"It was a joke," said The Mole. "A poor joke perhaps but Bernie was just making waves, trying to get F1 in the newspapers. He does it all the time. In Montreal Jacques Villeneuve was hopeless, wasn't he? It is an easy way to get people talking about the sport."

"I hear Danica is pretty feisty. If someone called me a domestic appliance, I'd slap him."

"She's a fireball," said The Mole. "But race ace slaps F1 boss is a great story, isn't it? Bernie doesn't mind a bit of slapstick, as long as the money keeps coming in."

"For that sort for money, you can slap me around," said Penelope.

The Mole raised an eyebrow.

"I must go and look in my piggy-bank," he muttered with a smile.

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26-June-2005 at 10:23

Originally posted by micky_h micky_h wrote:

No problem.I'm just waiting for Badger540 coming on and having a whinge for jumping a limo off a ramp into caravans now.

Sorry to disappoint you Micky... I took the advice not to watch Top Gear..... I found some damp Dulux to stare at instead....infinetley more enjoyable !! 

Andy

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27-June-2005 at 06:55

I thought this was probably the most objective view so far

http://www.itv-f1.com/Feature.aspx?Type=James_Allen&PO_I D=33214

 

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29-June-2005 at 08:24
FIA Press conference 2pm (uk time) teams shortly after, strange rumours circulating at moment ( BAR Banned - heavy fines for others etc)
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29-June-2005 at 18:14
I've stopped watching F1 as well, I agree with others views on Ferrari having one rule etc. Remember the Rubens thing where he had to slow down to let Michael pass? that was sad - but looks like its getting sadder all the time. Needs something new to make it interesting.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30-June-2005 at 05:11

Well the FIA have found the seven Michellin teams guilty on two counts, failing to bring a tyre to the race that was suitable and failing to start the race. The punishment will not be decided until the 14th of septemeber, I guess so that it won't affect the rest of the season.

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