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rubberknees50 View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06-December-2004 at 07:08

As a parent myself I have to support 25-30mph around schools, but I have had 2 no fault accidents at school run times due to other drivers not paying attention and giving me no chance whatever.

It is unfair and unrealistic to expect drivers to take ALL responsibility for watching for children in ALL built up areas, you'd have to get out and walk, or go back to the old "man with red flag" days.

With so much traffic, parked cars and distractions and the kids playing chicken or thinking you can stop a car from 25mph on the spot if they run straight into you or step off the kerb, sadly accidents are going to happen unless it's hammered into them from an early age that roads are NOT playgrounds and cars kill.

IanT
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Peter Fenwick View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06-December-2004 at 08:09

I can appreciate that the school run is a nightmare. I drive past a school on my way to work and if I am running a bit late I have to contend with it. Fortunately there are three lollypop ladies that do a strearling job and keep the kids safe. What doesn't help is the huge number of stupid 4x4s used by parents dropping kids off. One of the big problems on the roads today is that a lot of people show no consideration for anyone else, especially when they're driving a 2.5 tonne discovery.

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06-December-2004 at 09:32
The school run is a pain in the village where I live, thy all park up leaving only room for 1 car on the road at a time, and being on a bend, you don't know if anything is coming the other way..

[rant]And them flipping 4x4's are a pain in the butt, the bigest thing that they will drive over is a kerb. i had one reverse into me in a carpark once (while I was still in my car, saw it coming towards me, and crunch...big dent in my door).[/rant]
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06-December-2004 at 11:56

Same at school up the road from me, I appreciate the need to drop your kid off at the front gates, but when theres a pub right next door with a huge car park, it annoys me that for the sake of a 20 yard farther walk, they wont use it.

Would it be too much of a sensible idea for the schools to try and work out a timetable of staggered drop offs for the kids, so theres not so many cars/wee un's hanging around at the same time?


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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06-December-2004 at 12:36

 Yes !!! SOME comments ref Brainless Drivers are justified, agree about the School Zones-- Me-sometimes 10-15 mph cos there is NO control in the Zone--4 x 4s + anything else only interested in THEIR Kid, if you think its ok to allow Kid Power,to run out of the gates into the road--then you bring in Zones--NO CAR collections within 300 mtrs of the Gates , in arrive/depart times.

Parents held Liable for their Kids =  + points , maybe TOO revolutionary) for Anti Motorist org,s,  and the Anti use your legs brigade.If parents ignore the Zone regs, 90 days driving Ban-BET you- within a week --No prob.

This isnt the Point--- which IS-Slime Govt uses the motorist as the reason for every BAD thing on our Road--and everything else is due to their Professional skill and Knowledge , including walking on water.

I watch the future generations 10yrs going on 40  (if they survive) going to and from school at bus stops. Our roads are wide, straight visabilty, Have Underpasses EVERYWHERE for pedestrians and cyclists, to be kept apart from wicked Motorists--OK you guessed it!!- getting Off the bus means they cross the to the middle, and then dash if a 2 mtr gap--- yes!! sometimes they get redirected by a car-and its the Drivers fault--Must be-its on Darlings stats!!!!?????

 

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rubberknees50 View Drop Down
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Does it have chrome bumpers?

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06-December-2004 at 17:17

Agree 4x4 pain in bum, every school I pass is buried in cars at drop off/pick up time and from personal experience and observation when I was doing it (while my ex was ill from my place 7 miles away from school) far too many of them could more easily and efficiently walk.

I've been given hassle by head teachers for "inconveniencing" other parents by parking in the disabled space (I am disabled and have the badge) as it meant other people couldn't use the space to turn around. These included my ex's next door neighbour who lived 5 minutes walk away and taxi drivers as well as 4x4's that couldn't steer straight. I have pics of the level of parking inside and outside the scholl if anyones interested, I'dve been ashamed to leave one of mine parked like it. There are many problems on the roads today, but slamming the motorist seems to be the only popular solution.

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-December-2004 at 04:28

But aren't all the idiots in 4x4s motorists? and don't they deserve slamming? along with all the other fools that use hand held mobiles when driving, that don't understand the 2 second rule, that can't be bothered to walk their kids to school when they only live 5 minutes away etc etc. The thing that bothers me is that we are all tarred with the same brush.

The problem with speed cameras is that they don't address any of these issues, they just look at one aspect which alone is not the answer to making our roads safer.

B7VP, I must say you are very negative about the whole thing. I does anoy me too, but It's not the end of the world, there are a lot more important things to worry about Big Smile

After all at least we don't live in Iraq, or the former Soviet Union, and we weren't in the twin towers on 9/11 etc

 

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rubberknees50 View Drop Down
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Does it have chrome bumpers?

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-December-2004 at 08:09
Not all idiots in 4x4's, but don't get started on hand held mobiles, despite the new laws you can't go on a road without seeing morons with their hand stuck to their ear, HOW long have handsfree sets been out? I remember having one for my old Motorola C520, been using Bluetooth since before the law came in and I think even that is a distraction!
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-December-2004 at 09:56
where i live in a small village i have to walk my sister to school along side a VERY busy main road that large artics etc use,cause its a small school your not aloud to take the kids to school in the car apart from this 1 woman who owns a 4x4 who thinks shes better than anyone else who parks up on the grass verge across from the school,then drags her kids across a busy main road at rush hour just so she doesnt have to walk a little way!!! it is a real dangerous road by the school and as walking have witness many accidents,one of these days im sure something bad is going to happen as the only barrier between us and the road is a little strip of grass!weve tried to get them to either put up a saftey barrier alongside the path which would give us some protection or put these speed restriction signs up durin the morning and when school finishes but they wont until someone gets killed.rant over lol
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-December-2004 at 15:26

http://www.pistonheads.com/news/default.asp?storyId=9595

ROW RUMBLES OVER SCHOOL RUN DEATHS

Tuesday 7th December

Should children be driven to school? A political fight brews...

A political row over the benefits or otherwise of the taking of children to school by car as opposed to public transport or letting them walk is reaching fever pitch.

It stems from a report released recently by the insurer More Th>n, which has found that the number of journeys by car to school has risen by 20 per cent in the last decade, and that the number of children walking to school has dropped. Consequently, 7,000 people die or are injured in school run car accidents, says the report. Two hundred of the dead are children.

The reports goes on to suggest that a 10 per cent reduction in school commuting would save 190 lives and injuries, and that staggering school opening times could save 300 lives.

Anti-motoring organisations such as Transport 2000 responded by saying, "We have to tackle this parental culture whereby they believe that the only safe way to get their children to school is in the back of the car ... and I think the Government needs to get more out there and explain to parents why taking their children to school in the back of the car is not the best option."

Meanwhile, motoring organisations were split over the issue. The AA Motoring Trust weighed in on the side of the motorist, saying that parents have a right to take their children to school. Andrew Howard, head of road safety for the AA Motoring Trust, said, "The big thing is the fact that people want to have the freedom to choose which school their children go to ... I think the Government has got to remember that it [would be] making a major change to peoples lives and a lot of people want to do with what fits in with their lives."

However, the RAC said that more needed to be done to reduce parents' dependence on using their car to get their children to school. A spokeswoman said, "More needs to be done to reduce the number of cars used in the school run ... With 40,000 children hurt in road accidents in Britain every year, safe transport methods are paramount when devising routes to school."

PistonHeads thinks that, if lives can be saved and school run congestion relieved by allowing more children to get to school by other means, then parents should be encouraged -- but not forced -- to use them.


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rubberknees50 View Drop Down
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Does it have chrome bumpers?

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-December-2004 at 16:00

Pistonheads above about right.There's been a lot of debates lately about congestion, overweight underexecised kids, but it is still a free country.

Safety? speed? interestingly the moron who rear ended me during the school run was only doing 30mph, and continued to do so straight into the back of my "old" car, which only took minor damage due to the solid build, chrome bumpers and huge rubber overriders. Every panel on his escort (no, not a 4x4) was bent and his 8yr old was unrestrained in front seat so went through windscreen.

He was more upset that the police attended as he had used all his money to buy the car and hadn't bothered insuring it. I have heard it is fairly common for drivers with no licence or no insurance to buy MoT'd cars as they are less likely to get stopped. How do speed cameras prevent that?

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rubberknees50 View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-December-2004 at 16:07
Sorry, last post should have been tax'd and MoT'd.
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Nigel View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08-December-2004 at 04:09
Originally posted by B 7 VP B 7 VP wrote:

[QUOTE=Goldryder]And 30mph will still kill a child.

>>> NO mention of parental training whatsoever?????, how come ALL the Safety partnerships are NOT Shouting "Green Cross code " Day & Night????? cos there is No money in it and Look Look Look, isnt as Dramatic, as Speed Kills.93% of accidents are not speed related--NOT that this fact is included in any DOT Bliarspeak.Just the same as the 4000 death,s each year in the Home--is of No concern-NO money!!

So the answer for habitual speeders is to have a DOT restrictor in the car, and only work use (So TAX can be paid) So presume habitual Drug & Drinkers will get an electric shock from state fitted wrist strap, each time they have a thought.Why not take it to the Logical end, get Chippeduk to get US rechipped, sounds like the "Thought Police", maybe someone could write a book about it--1984--BUT-- its already a way of life-NOW.

We need to preserve OUR Right of Freedom & choice, NOT surrender it to govt parasites.



 

I've just read this post from John, and although I agree with what it says, just one little point for the legal types....Horsey ? To look into.

We have had similar discussions on the IAM forum, believe it or not a lot of IAM people, including policemen have detectors.

Regarding pedestrians : please find me one LAW that requires a pedestrian to "give way" to a motor vehicle.

I think you will find there arent any, or at least the legal brains with big books in the IAM cant find one.

Except in areas where they are banned, ( motorways etc ), pedestrians ALWAYS have priority over any other form of transport, and on the IAM forum it was quoted as comong from the 14th century or so, and was in regard to horses, but now applies to all vehicles.

This is why when your involved in an accident with a pedestrian you are always at fault !

Best Wishes

Nigel

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08-December-2004 at 04:28
Originally posted by rubberknees50 rubberknees50 wrote:

Pistonheads above about right.There's been a lot of debates lately about congestion, overweight underexecised kids, but it is still a free country.

Yeah maybe if Kids walked to school, less of them would look like they had just come from a lock in at a pie shop!! the same goes for parents.

People these days amaze me, spending a fortune on a gym membership but then driving round the corner to the local shop, or taking the lift rather than the stairs. makes no sense to me c

On the subject of Nigels post, one of the problems we have is that pedestrians take very little or no responsibility for them selves at all. At least children have the excuse of being imature and irresponsible through no fault of there own, but adults should no better. For instance how often do you see people crossing the road 50yards from a pedestrian crossing, or running accross when there are cars comming just because the can't be bothered to wait for the green man. If you ask me Jay walking should be illegal in this country, just like it is in the USA and Germany.

And lets not forget cyclists........ Angry

Oh and on the subject of right of way, I was under the impression that drivers were only prosecuted following a collision with a pedestrian if they are judged to have been driving dangerously, or without due care and attention.

 

 



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Nigel View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08-December-2004 at 05:09

Prosecuted, and regarded as being at fault so their insurance pays are two different things.

It would appear pedestrians actually have very little or no responsibility in law. I'm not saying this is fair or good, just valid.

Cyclists are totaly covered by the vehicle regs....for now !

The fact this isnt enforced is another topic, but please note that in many EU countries, cyclists have now been given the same status as pedestrians, Holland for one, and the lycra louts are trying very hard to get this over here.

Best Wishes

Nigel

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rubberknees50 View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08-December-2004 at 07:25

Sounds like a prime case of "the law is an ass" Nigel, if we rely on a 14th century law for modern traffic.

It may be legal but is it justice when a pedestrian, adult or child, runs out into the road into your vehicle and it's automatically your fault as a driver, even if you were within the speed limit, keeping your distance and alert!

We have all seen many incidents such as Peter above describes, I have had a postman turn sharply off the pavement without any attempt at looking and walk straight into the side of my car on brookside. I think I was doing all of 25mph at the time, and yet legally thats my fault?

Personal responsibility for our actions and and respect for others we were mostly brought up with, but sadly there's a generation out there for whom nothing is their fault, ever.

If I make a mistake driving I will happily put my hand up, if some moron can't be bothered to look and gives me no chance to avoid them, why should that automatically be my fault!

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